Cortisone Injections

Bones, joints and muscles
1

Has anyone found that these injections make you put on weight. I have had a fair few and due for some more next week. In the beginning I had a spine injection and then  in the leg -  I am on Pazital and Lyrica but a lose dose.  But looking back, the injections have been the best as I walk quite a bit.

 I know the UK have a maximum - but can't remember how many.  I last had the injections about 3 years ago, 4 in one thigh and 3 in the other.  I suppose it depends on the strength too but I haven't ever been told the strength. 

2

It depends on whether you are talking about steroid injections into a joint or into muscle. Injections into the joints are limited to 3 - because they can cause damage to tendons if you have too many. As far as I know, intramuscular injections aren't limited and they can be used as an alternative to oral pred - but they have exactly the same sort of side effects as oral pred and that includes weight gain. Lyrica has weight gain as a side effect too.

Interested to know why you are on Lyrica for OA though.

3

Hi Eileen, I have just read my message, this Lyrica is really now messing my head... Sorry about it.  The spine injection was into the bottom of my spine - one was X Ray lead - can't remember the other.  The other ones I had were in the thigh and bottom.  I can't believe this is going on, yesterday I couldn't remember the word crane and it upset me.  

Oh heavens I can't remember whether the thigh was into the bone or not, I will ask this time when I go 

Well I was given Lyrica for nerve end pain.  I have had 2 ops, one where they put a jack into your spine to stop the bone touching a nerve and the other was decompression.

When I came to spain it has taken me such a long time to get info but as usual I had to pay for MRI and X Rays in Benidorm - so I have L4/5 and L3/4 prolapsed and I think S1/L5 is on the way. The nerve pain was beyond any pain I have had, I couldn't even walk into Asda supermarket in England before I came to Spain, now I can walk but at the end I am in terrible pain and thats why..... I have seen a surgeon and he says that to have an operation would be dangerous but two private surgeons I saw both said that I would be walking out of the hospital with fusion - oh yes...... and that will be 20,000€ thank you very much.  And fusion is not always successful.  It can cause the bottom disc to drop but then it can't drop any more can it.  

Thats the brief story but I am not paying out any more, I wouldn't get insurance and I'm not paying any more - I must have gone through 20,000 both euros and £s getting treatment faster and I am no better.

So I don't know what to do now, I can walk a little without pain but I just think I have to get on with it when the pain starts, and if its something I want to do, I just take extra.  The dr says I take a low dose anyway so no wonder I am in pain.....The dr I am seeing at the pain clinic has advised me to go onto pregabalin and although Lyrica is supposed to be the same, I will try it out.

Interested what you would do?

Sorry about the delay in replying, my partner keeps me going to all sorts of places to keep my mind going....

4

I do know that lyrica and pregabalin seem to work differently for some people so one might work better than the other.

What would I do? Really have no idea. I have a chronic rheumatism and my attitude is to ignore the possibilities and wait until I get to any bridge before deciding if I will cross it or not! My husband is the opposite - just like his mother who drove me up the wall with her "What if..." and turned me into a rather short-sighted navigator 

I live in Italy - but we don't need private insurance here and our regional healthcare service is still very good. What it will be like in years to come I have no idea - but I shall wait and see.

5

Hi, Enna, I have a brutrans time release patch.  Its 10 micro grams.  I wear the patch for a week at a time.  It really helps me with severe pain in my spine in conjunction with my Vicodin 325mg.  I use four vicodin a day.  I have many issues you have for instance.  L-4 5 have had ruputures.  L-5 S1 has a fusion and L-4 they put a cage in to support my spine.  My last and final surgery was in  2002..  I really do not suggest surgeries.  Due to the fact that your spine will get arthritis and then it just collaspes over time. All in all the patch may help you.  Also I have a tens unit that is really powerful. The Dr. prescribed it and the insurance paid for it.  I also use Lidoderm patches when I need them. Jan

6

Hi Jan, just a note to say sorry I haven't replied to you.  We are going up into the mountains this weekend to see the dinasaur footprints so I will get back to you next week

Keep going, my appt with the surgeon on Friday wasn't too good.  12 more weeks to wait.....

Anyway speak next week. Anne

7

I am so sorry you have to have surgery.  What did the surgeon say, Do you have RA or Osterioarthritis or RA.  I don't have damage to my hips or knees yet? Is just have joint pain and Osteoarthritis.  My prayers are with you all the time.  I just got back from seeing the internist.. My blood pressure was through the roof 190/100., Once I knew the numbers I had an anxiety attack.  Came home and took more blood pressure meds.  Pressure is coming down slowly.  They gave me an EKG and all is well.  They referred me to a cardiologist for a work up.  Good advice since I haven't had a workup in five years.  All this because the pain has flar so much the blood pressure is way up.  Not normal for me.  Mine BP runs about 130/67.  We are leaving on Monday for a week and I don't think we will  have internet.  I will have verizon coverage only.  The damage in your spine is caused by what? Is is RA or Osteo? I understand L-4-5 and 5 S1.  You probably have rupurtured discs.  Do not have rods and bolts.  You will regret.  If you have anything done.  They should be able to go in with a bandaid type opening and fix the ruputure.  I had L/5 rupurture and had fusion.  L-4 collasped 20 years later and I had them build a cage with cadeavor bone.  No rods and bolts.  No surgery for me.  What country near you has more liberal socialized medicine.  Or do you have a teaching hospital that takes patients who are in need financially.  $20K would not be something we could handle at all!.  Sorry you find yourself in this situation.  I just thought if you flew to the states and went to Loma Linda in Orange Cty Ca. you could get in and you would pay on a sliding scale.  You would have to do some research to consider this option?  Many hugs are coming your way.  Hugs Jan

8

Hi jan, the surgeon in November said it would be dangerous to operate and the Dr in the pain clinic as last time although a diff doc,just about makes me climb the wall. He has suggested another x ray lead spinal injection but even if it works it will need to be replaced. He did show the x rays to us and HD said it was partial decompression at l4\5. This is diff info I have had from others. Honestly I am going round in circles. Its. Spinal stenosis, and nerve pain and as the report is in Spanish I don't really know although I remember buts and pieces. By in Warrington the surgeon said he had decompressed l4\5 and l3\4 and that l5\s1 was going the same way. I am like my mum she has osteoarthritis, she had a cyst on her knee and she had dry skin on her nose, exactly like me. What I don't understand is this confusion they are telling me about prolapsed discs and now the don't mention the l3\4. 2 yrs ago I consulted a surgeon and he did advise rods, screws, and cage. Then a friend recommended someone in Valencia he said the same. But....as this would be private the same as my Warrington op am I going to be chested again. I was told he decompressed 2 levels , now I find he only did a partial decompression at 1 level. I am just saying this all costs money and I feel cheated. Are you following me....!!!! My partner is furious although I paid for this myself.

Oh I didn't tell you but the 2 surgeons - well more than them - hadn't been paid for 3 months by the Valencia government so they went private!!!!

Had a feeling you were writing from the states - been to California in fact where we have been today is just like monument valley.

So.... the appt on Friday I have to wait 12 weeks!!! Spain is better than uk. Although I think I was cheated with the decompression, when I started work and like everyone else, we contributed to thenhs but its not the same now. I mean I was in so much pain 10 yes ago I used to pay to see a doctor to find out quick. The surgeon I saw in November he said it was too dangerous to operate because I had SK much scar tissue. As I am a resident in Spain,the uk pays Spain 3,000pounds towards my health care and as I am a pensioner. Paying over 40 years into the NHS I would have been better paying insurance. So complicated!!!! I paid to see someone in the north east of england ( about 8 yes ago) had MRIs and xrays - these were read by the surgeons registrar and he told the surgeon there was nothing wrong with my back. I feel I will pop my clogs before I get relief.

Yep tried tens machine until my lead went down a dirty Spanish toilet!!

This is why I really want injections. Not sure about an op but this lyrics is driving me mad I just forward to July when I saw this books for a spinal injection who knows these new injections might work for enough time to see what's going to happen next.

Yes rods and screws plus artificial discs sound good but it sffedcts the disc below. One or two surgeons are panicking in the uk and don't do these ops any more. They too have pulled out of the NHS and gone private.

What I don't understand is that there are so many people with back problems you would think they would be experimenting with something else. The first surgeon who did the jacking up of one of my discs with something called Inspsce. I know for a fact he was practicing on me -

Anyway have a good week wherever you are going - how's the heat? We watched 4 July on San Diego beach was fantastic but the Spanish have good fireworks too. Uk think too much of health and safety!!! Enjoy anyway and have a good time. Anne

9

Hi, Enna1;  Its sounds as though you are at a stand still regarding your back issues.  First off let me say that any friends I have had that have screws, bolts and rods  put in their backs are Sorry they did.  The pain cycle starts all over again.  Do not have surgery.  Try anything and everything you can to stay out of the operating room.  I have suffered for many years regarding back issues.  I feel personally that injecitons work, put it depends on what kind and their are many.  You will need to have a clear understanding of what procedures you are having and why. You will need the injections where the Doctor uses a radiograph guided needle into your back.  The needle can be seen on a computer screen above your head or to the side.   This allows the Doctor to direct the pain medication directly where he or she want it to go.  I have found that ablations work the best.  This is where they go in and burn the nerves surrounding the areas you are having the most pain. This procedure lasts me about 8 months, sometimes longer. Again I use my tens unit, supplied by my Doctor.  I use Lidoderm patches, by prescription only.  Plus Bio Freeze, a cream I purchase at the Army Base here in the States Vicodin, and muscle relaxants.  Most MRI's have a written description of what was found on the MRI.  If you can read what it says and send my way, maybe I can help you understand some of what is said.  I was raised in a medical family and I feel have a good understanding of anatomy.  Looking forward to hearing from you.  Jan

10

Hep Jan, I have never heard of a successful fusion either, I have decided not to do it. I am 73 and the last surgeon said it was dangerous but go back to him if the pain clinic cortisone injections are not working.  The only spinal injections that have worked for me are injections in my thigh and bottom. Lasted well over a year and could wall well.

Yep had the injections via X Ray, twice, neither worked more than a few weeks and the latter cost me £1,000.  I am a bit cynical about private insurance - not that I had it - I just paid up - I think the surgeon sees money goes past his eyes.

You seem quite organised with your pain as I am with Lyrica and pazital but Lyrica is messing with my memory - don't like it at all, I forget simple words like bus, desk, carrots those sort of words. It makes me sound as though my brain isn't working and it isn't.

I have had so many injections, I am not sure whether I have had the burning of nerves, I could have done.  First one I had one dr was talking to the other, second one was so strong I I was about 2 hrs on a bed coming round and then it lasted oh about 2 months or so.  then I have had injections not X ray lead but the ones that worked was my thigh and buttock.  Great - and I want to walk not just round the supermarket.  I didn't like my tens but still got it.   Arrh just read you are in the States, different drugs although some are the same.  I thought that fusions were successful in the States but maybe not.  As I said to someone on this forum, if you have private insurance, the surgeon seems money passing their eyes.  

Well the last time I saw a surgeon he said it was dangerous to do fusion although to pay for this op, two surgeons told me I would be walking out of the hospital on the second day lol.  Good job I have done a bit of research and waited a bit.

I am in Spain Jan and they have already messed me up with appointment and must go.  Speak later.

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Jan messed up the appt. Can't explain but had phone call to say I should have been at the hospital, I have never known them getting ready. Any way I also have an appt for July at traumatology. I should have been there at 8.30 so we rushed down put my card in the machine and there it was in black and white no appt. So went home. Then went back at 12 for 1 when my appt was. But by about 2 peter peter realized that people had a piece of paper and a yellow backing we didn't have the yellow bit. Anyway we were last in the waiting room and this woman w

Dr. /nurss went on and on explaining and peter hadnt a clue.cutting a long story short she is sending us as other appt. Peter has gone round to his friends and he is sorting it with his friend he plays tennis with.

What a flipping mix up but sure its a spine injection. I saw different patients coming out in tears and thought yes this is it. So nothing will happen for a while.

Tell me what meds you have tried pls ? Some are similar here but different names and vice versa.

With regard to injections I know about spinal ones, xray led ones and facet joint ones. L4\5 and l3\4 and s1 is on the easy out...

But its taken me 11 years to get to this stage now my WiFi is going!! Uk was terrible I have got on better here but if I keep on waiting for asppts like this today I will be disappointed. I have to say there isn't much they can do. I told the Dr that the pain was in my groin and at the top of my hip bone which I didn't think it was anything to do with discs.what do you think. Did you have pain in yr groin and hip. To me it sounds like my hip is going as well. I am fine though with lyrics except for forgetting names anyway its almost bed time and was wondering where you live in the states maybe you told me but if I scroll back I lose the message....whast a flipping day!!!! God bless anne

12

Not sure if I've understood what you said - but pain that is in groin and over your hip bone could be trochanteric/iliosoas bursitis. Just a thought.

13

Dear Enna1, Please be sure you have light sedation with each injection.  Its easier on the body.  I have to have my two hips injected very soon..I couldn't bear the injections without sedation.  The meds I am on are Brutrans 10mg.  Which I beleive is a light morphine patch which allows medication to enter the body over a 7 day period.  I also take vicodin 325mg.  Four times a day.  I do wear a light back brace when necessary and use a cane when necessary.  I try to ride my bike whenever possible.  I see your husband plays tennis.  I miss the game so much.  I injured myself playing and kept playing like a fool.  But I loved the game and was very competitive.  You asked where we live, Arizona.  We love the outdoors and we travel in our fifth wheel whenever possible.  I do hope some of what I have shared has helped you.  Yes, I have had groin pain and their is an injection called a caudel. The pain was in my groin almost felt like I was giving birth.  The pain can travel to the groin because of L-4 and 5 being in the lower back.  The injection in the groin is given in the very lowest part of the back.  Hope you get relief.  I think you are only able to have three injections a year.  At least I last as long as I can before I have to have an injection.  God Bless you, Jan

14

Enna, I think you are correct with the bursitis in the hip.  My pain is getting worse and will have to have injection.  Probably within the next two weeks.

Jan

15

Enna1 you are and me are about the same age.  I will be 70 in July.  I think I started getting worse about two months ago.  That is why I am going to the Rhymotologist for a series of tests.  This way my Internist and Pain Docs can work together to get me stabilized. Lyrica makes me crazy and I lose my thoughts and feel very spacey.  Not for me. 

 

16

Eileen, been tested in England for bursitis and the treatment in the UK was so bad that it was never mentioned again.  I wondered whether it was hip though!!

 

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"been tested for bursitis"??  "the treatment was so bad it was never mentioned again"??? What on earth did they do?

I described the pain, when it was worst, what made it worse, the doc prodded the outside of my hip (where the bony bit sticks out) and I squealed. That is also how they identified the right place to do the injection.  They found the spot where I said the pain was at its worst when they pressed. It isn't a intra-articular injection, it's into soft tissue, so doesn't need any imaging to get it in the right place. It didn't hurt at the time any more than any other injection and worked in about 2 or 3 days.

Mind you - we do have a very good orthopaedic department with people coming from all over Italy for certain procedures and spare doctors as we need a lot in the winter during the ski season and in the summer for mountaineers and motocyclists. So they do a lot of elective surgery in the quiet seasons.

Yet another reason to stay here by the sound of things!

18

You won't believe this but I was looking up Paracetamol and found this - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-3497386/Paracetamol-useless-treating-arthritis-pain-dose-major-study-finds.html

Trouble is - looking it up I deleted the message I had written to you was lost.

I am just going shopping so will be back.

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Eileen, the dr just said he thought but I went to 2/3 drs in England in the practice so didn't know whether I was coming or going.  But then I have x rays to say that I have prolapsed discs and I had completely forgotten about the bursitis and now wonder whether the injections in my thigh was helping the bursitis. It was a jolly good injection too I didn't have to go back for about a year.  He did the other thigh too.  But then it may have been referred pain as when I was asked the other day where I felt pain I said in the groin, in my bottom and in my thigh.  I will ask when I go to the dr again but then peter says I throw them off the path because I ask questions. "Treatment bad" - , after the dr who gave me injections in England left the practice, I went back to the practice and saw the dr who had taken over from him. He was the only one qualified - so he said - to do injections !!!  He said he wouldn't give me any more injections. I went back twice and said I was in pain - in fact he was quite rude. So I suffered until I actually paid to go and see an orthopaedic surgeon about 2 hrs drive from where I live - I told him where the pain was and he did an injection into my spine - i went private and it cost me £1,000. By about 2 months the injection had worn off.

This ortho did the decompressionat L4/5  when I couldn't stand the pain any longer - I went private there because I trusted him and knew I was coming to spain. I can't remember him saying anything about bursitis but then it was the prolapsed discs I was there for -  I couldn't walk at all.

 

I  don't have back pain now at all and when you think I have 2 prolapsed discs l3/4 and l4/5 and S1/l3 looks like going,  you would think that I would have back pain.but maybe the decompression worked and I am left with bursitis. I can't lay on that side at all and have to be careful as it can be v painful, usuallly I put a hot water bottle on the area and then it goes for a few weeks.

Answering your comments: I described the pain, when it was worst, what made it worse, the doc prodded the outside of my hip (where the bony bit sticks out) and I squealed. That is also how they identified the right place to do the injection. NO-ONE HAS PRESSED MY HIP BONE AT ALL - IF i PRESS MY HIP BONE IT JUST HURTS. its my thigh Eileen.

Sounds like you have found the Italian Medical service OK, I found the spanish one OK as well, the little bits of errors that are made are really probably because of our new hospital - its just getting into the way of doing things, as we didn't have all this paperwork 5 years ago.

No I just want to say that the practice I went to in my home town we pretty awful and we have spoken about not going back to live there because of it.  We are sure that the drs thought I was putting on the pain. Peter used to say to me, you are in pain, don't smile but thats not me. The lady dr used to sit with me and chat about her family or do exercises that I knew and did already (I have been going to yoga for many years) and do them at home now. Its not what the drs did, its what they didn't do - 

From the beginning my osto referred me to Darlington for XRays. I took them to the dr and she said there was no one who could help in Cumbria so I asked to go to Liverpool Pain Clinic (its a lot different now) the dr sat there with a handkerchief over his nose and said he couldn't do anything and gave peter a leaflet about caring for him.  Then I took my X Rays to Preston and had a wedge like thing in my spine which came out within 3 months (and thats why I can't have an op) from there it changed and you could go anywhere in England for consultation - so I read up and chose a Greek man in Middlesborough.  Had X Rays/MRIs again and the Registrar looked at them and said there was absolutely nothing wrong with my back. I was devastated.  In between I have had 4 spine injections.

From there I went to Warrington privately and the ortho gave me a another spine injection - very strong. Then I went back to him for decompression but the latter was in desperation. No-one was interested in my home town and I couldn't walk, I got the impression that they thought I was putting it on. But I thought the decompression didn't work as I was now still in pain. Standing for my medical card just about killed me, standing for 3 days on the trot!!!  And thinking now, maybe it was bursitis but I will know when I have this injection won't I???  If I still have the pain it very well could be bursitis.  

Our Spanish friend is now helping us with this cock up with the paperwork so if I see his dr friend (he plays tennis with him) I will ask him about bursitis, he did say I could go back to him for help.  So thats the answer.

I've just come back from a saunter up in the hills and I am OK but it was only a 15 minute saunter.

Thats for reminding me about bursitis, it sounds stupid doesn't it that I forgot - and dr colomer who did my injections in the old hospital, I don't think he works at the new hospital as I haven't seen his name but he did the best thigh injections.

One last question - if you had bursitis did your thigh hurt?  Anne

 

20

Eileen I see I haven't answered questions, I was given Lyrica by the dr for pain he said.   I was told that Pregabalin and Lyrica was the same, but funnily enough, I had a better pain reaction on Pregabalin than Lyrica. But I got the Pregabalin from the chemist in Benidorm because she didn't have Lyrica.  Maybe I will try it again if I can get round the chemist....... Heck you sound really technical when the dr at the practice in England gave me intremuscular injections he said they were limited to 3 which suprised me when Dr colomer here gave me 3 in one thigh, tested my other thigh and said he would do a couple of injections into that thigh too.   I have made notes to ask. Many thanks again.  Its usually someone else that can see things better than the person who has the problem!!! Thanks