Living with Hiatus hernia and vagus nerve problems for 30 years

Digestive health
21

Dear Welshexport - as a Welshman I will due my duty and help u out. You said 'Then in 1993 we moved to a new area and the problems I was having were not getting any better I was getting more and more neck pain shoulder pain and pain between my shoulder blades. But my stomach was always very acidy so my house doctor sent me to an internist who gave me my first examination with an endoscope and found that I had a small hiatus hernia this was in 1994. This was the first time that I was put on omeprazol 40mg and have been taking this medication since then.  The past couple of years my back pain has got a lot worse underneath my shoulder blades my neck my left shoulder sometimes my arm goes numb and now my left breast aches like hell and I now have a lot of pain in my left arm pit. I am in continuous pain right between my shoulder blades'

I think you have a cervical vertebrae problem - the usual discs are C5 or C6 or C7. As the discs wear out as we get older they become thiner. As they become thinner they start to iritate the nerves leaving the foramen (which is part of the vertebrae) This nerve root iritation then manefests itself as pain between the shoulder blade The other thing that can happen is this. Because the nerve root is irritated, it also affects the autonomic system (vagal nerve). The nerve roots coming out of each cervical vertebrae (at the foramen) are both sensory and autonomic (vagal) - so the area that is affected is your stomach. I would not be surprised if you were also missing a few hear beats as well. (atrial fib) So to summerise. Nerve root irritation in the neck causes pain in the shoulder blades and increased acid secretion in the stomach. My advice - get an MRI of your neck. All the best (PS - chest pain and deltoid pain - https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2881998/)

22

Hi,

I found this very informative. I was diagnosed

with a hiatus hernia and GORD 7 years ago. I have been taking nexium 40mg all that time with no issue until recently.

I recently had 2 bouts of gastro with agressive vomiting and a mild chest infection.

After that i started getting chest pain and a mild pinch in my back. I ended up having what the doctors think was a panic attack and told i have developed anxiety but I'm not sold.

I've had multiple ECGs and blood test which are clear.

My back pain has worsened inc. neck stiffness and headaches which i never get. I'm getting random pains, left hand tingling, my left eye keeps dilating and i have buzzing feeling in my chest too.

I'm wondering if the vomiting has worsened my hernia or I've trapped a nerve in my back but the Dr's shrug it off. I'm seeing a gastroenterologist who is looking into it but he thinks its anxiety too.

Has anyone had any solution to this issue or suggestions? As I seem to be at the beginning of some of what you describe.

Any feedback would be much appreciated.

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I am interested in learning the exercises that help. Thank you.

24

Hi

If you don't mentally feel anxious (and most people can tell how they feel in themselves) - it is likely to be your vagus nerve.  Most mainstream Doctors like to call things anxiety when they don't understand a problem. I would often get feelings of "impending doom" - it was a really odd and horrible sensation easily confused with mental anxiety. The very fact that I wasn't mentally anxious about anything allowed me to understand that it was physical.  Often the feeling would be followed by ectopic heartbeats and chest pain.  I now know I have dysautonomia - probably stemming from connective tissue disease (floppy collagen ie floppy sphincters all through the gut causing reflux, poor motility,  gas build up,  barretts esophagus [despite being female under-weight non drinker non smoker only early 40s]).  Probably some digestive issue was affecting the vagus nerve causing the autonomic wackiness. In many people this feeling of doom could easily morph into true anxiety or a panic attack because obviously it does feel quite scary. If you presented with at ER with the scenario I described above – they would note your low blood pressure (from the connective tissue disease/autonomic dysfunction) and the high heart rate (caused by the body compensating for the low blood pressure)  Without the time and understanding of the whole person and their unique physiology  (understandable in an ER – where their main focus is on keeping people from dying or becoming seriously unwell) many people would be diagnosed with anxiety because A) that’s what it looks like and B) other than the relatively mild anomalies with BP and heart rate (which is from the anxiety anyway :-P ) there is nothing wrong with you. 

25

Hi

I know this was over a year ago but I was wondering if your any nearer finding out anymore on this subject? I have been going through this for 7 years now and the last 3 weeks have been hell!!! I have continuous heart palps as soon as I eat or drink. I also have all your symptoms and doctors have send me for heart test, stress test all fine! It wakes me from sleeps and also have this tight feeling around my ribs especially at night! It stops me from sleeping right. I also have bloating and indigestion. Currently living on renny. Sick to death of feeling irritable all the time. I also have random pains throughout my body too. At the end of my wicks now. Any advise would be greatly appreciated. All the doctors tell me is its anxiety " yes most likely as I'm panicky now"

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Dear Anne ' I have continuous heart palps as soon as I eat or drink' it sounds like you have Atrial fibrillation. Usually AF occurs with increased sympathetic tone (increased stress etc) and patients are treated with B blockers such as Bisoprolol (to reduce the Beta sympathetic tone) However some patients - by eating / drinking can stimulate the vagal nerve in the stomach and by doing so increase the parasympathetic vagal tone. The increased parasympathetic tone can have affect on the heart by elongating the QT interval - by doing so extra beats from the atrium can kick in and lead to atrial fibrillation. Solution - get your cardiologist to look at your ECG trace and conduct an echocardiogram. Determine what type of AF (if any) either sympathetically or parasympathetically induced - then go the appropraite medicine. This could bisoprolol / diltiazem or flectanide or maybe have a cardiac ablation. The main thing though is speak to an experienced cardiologist and go from there

27

Hi Anne!  I totally understand what you're going through because I have the same thing and I've been to a cardiologist and they tell me everythings ok. I didn't have this problem until I had laparoscopic surgery to remove my gall bladder in 2009. I had to have another surgery 2 years later because of pain and the doctor told me that the probe insertion in my soloar plexus area should have never been done in that area because they partly severed a nerve...yikes. I don't have the shooting pain anymore but have all the symptoms you talk about after eating a meal. I hope someday to find a doctor who knows how to deal with the Vagus Nerve issues. Lets stay connected while we stay on a path to healing the issue. 

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Hi. Illy

Thank you for your reply. I have today been to the doctor today who is referring me to a cardiologist (10th Feb) I had an ECG that looked fine she said but wants to have it checked out more. She gave me the blockers today.

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Hi Richard!  Did you ever have any type of surgery for the hernia repair? The Vagus Nerve issue seems to go undiagnosed and cause a lot of problems for many people. Maybe we can stay connected and start a group that can find some answers and solutions to the problem. Julie in Vegas :-) 

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Hi Julie

Thanks for your reply. Yesterday and today I have had achy shoulder blades so off I went to the docs this morning. ECG all ok and I have been given blockers. She has referred me to the cardiologist in Feb! My ribs are so sensitive today but she said stomach felt fine too. I'm assuming all anxiety makes it worse but when I get these pains there frightening. I also have a UTI so on antibiotics

31

Hi Anne!

I highly recommend getting the "Quell" device. I purchased one 2 months ago because of pain and it's amazing. I wear it everyday for 4-6 hours and sometimes at night. It really does help. I wish I had more time to do research and figure this Vagus Nerve issue out and/or find a doctor who knows all about it. I find that if I do very small meals it helps me. 

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remember with AF its quite hard to diagnose because the 'palps' come and go. So  you need to have a 24hr monitor.

nothing to worry about though - all this can be fixed

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Yes that's what they are giving me. 24hr monitor.

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Anne, 

For about 20 years now, I've been living what I am convinced are vagus nerve related symptoms caused by my sliding hiatal hernia.  I have no heartburn at all.  The symptoms I have are right side chest pain, right side throat pain, and right side ear and cheek paresthesia.  They slowly occur 10-20 minutes after pressure is applied to my abdomen especially when sitting, and quickly disappear upon lying flat on my back or standing up.  The more upright the sitting, and the tighter my pants are, the higher the pain and the quicker the pain starts.  I'm convinced the symptoms are related to pressure from the stomach sliding through the hiatus, applied to the vagus nerve, (which passes through the hiatus), causing referred pain to areas which are enervated by the vagus nerve (which includes chest, throat, cheek and ears).  HOWEVER, I am not a medical professional, and have been unable to find a doctor who recognizes a vagus nerve connection.  I have a sympathetic surgeon who three years ago offered to repair the hiatal hernia as a possible treatment for my symptoms, but told me straight out that he has no idea if it would work.  I continue to decline to acquiesce with what he suggests (my apologies to Pirates of the Caribbean), but each year I grow a little closer to rolling the dice on the operation. 

While I’m not a medical professional, I am a retired research scientist, and in my search for information on non-reflux hiatal hernia symptoms came across about a half dozen medical papers that describe a subset of patients with hiatal hernias that have no heartburn but do have other symptoms such as atypical chest pain.  However, almost as soon as the author is done describing this subset of patients, they quickly move onto to the bread-and-butter issue of heartburn treatment, and completely forget about them.    

It’s very perplexing

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Thank for sharing it's nice to know someone else has the same .

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Thanks for sharing! . I have many of the same exact symptoms. When you described your palpitations and neck and jaw pain. I couldn't believe the similarity to my own experience! I was diagnosed with HH last year, but every time I feel the pain and burning, I feel certain that it is something more! The cardiologist assured me it is not my heart, but I can't stop thinking they he's missing something. I had an endoscopy one year ago, but maybe I need more tests. Today was a horrible day!! It's good to know there are others out there.

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Hello! I can't believe you have been suffering for 20 years! I have had these symptoms for about two years and feel like I am losing my mind! They found my HH last year, but other than nexium, gave memo real advice or help. It is not getting better. Cardiologist tests were negative, but that was a year and a half ago. I feel like I need more tests. I just turned 50. It is so frustrating!!! Thanks for sharing.

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Hi, Richard. I have a hiatus hernia and convinced some of my symptoms are caused by pressure on the Vagas nerve. I found that drinking coffee causes bile reflux which creates gas as the bile mixes with my stomach acid. This increases the pressure in my stomach and presses on the Vagas nerve. When this happens I feel very ill and have to lie down. I find that half a teaspoon of bicarbonate of soda in a third of a glass of water kills the acid better tha all your antacids and my symptoms improve within an hour. Avoiding coffee including decaf and tea helps a lot. Also don't wear anything tight round your waist this can actually cause a hiatus hernia. I wear braces. Another helpful tip. Try drinking a pint of water and bouncing on a mini trampoline. This helps pull the stomach out of the diaphragm. Best of luck.

39

One part that people who have hiatal hernia and GERD rarely touch on is

Health anxiety

A condition people might not be aware it is there!!!!!!

It happened to me

Being a doctor myself i thought this will help .

I experienced a bit of chest tightness and bowel changes as well as epigastric pain and i think its to do with regurgitation and osphygitis and spasms

And with an episode of poo colour change i couldn't stop thinking cancer with the persistent symptoms that started to progress to stomach pain and right chest pain and exaggerated bowel symptoms ,weight loss , burning sleep problems

GPs are usually very helpful if you raise the issue but also they will think safety and risk assessment in the sense of other people safety at your work place and first think they may think time off and stress management and occupational health.

So understand how pain works in our bodies

If i pinch or needle stick you or burn you on the skin, your body will feel the accurate type of pain at the very precise point it happened .

The nerves that does that are called somatic nerves which are excessively supplying skin and much more developed and accurate than the nerves that supply of our internal organs , the latest called autonomic nervous system.

The inside organs are supplied by a big random nerve network that supply the larynx osphygus stomach heart liver and bowel bladder called Vagus nerve

And guess what it does not only carry pain signals to brain but also give other orders to organs as (tells the heart rate to speed up or down) ( bowel and bladder to be quite or feels needing emptying) depending on stress ,fight ,fright levels

A competitive athletic sacrificing productive giving pleasing personality known personality type A usually get gutted coz of much stress they carry inside

Hence the wide variety people describe symptoms of GERD and HH and IBS as all linked to stress and anxiety levels

So dont expect when you have HH that you would only get globus or chest pain or epigastric pain or heart burn palpitations, butterflies in stomach or spastic colon or palpitaions or weight loss

You can get some or any or all as all controlled by vagus

40

Absolutely true

Vagus can cause mental issues coz of how vague symptoms can be

I almost went to health anxiety if not already through it thinking there must be somthing wrong

Any way headache chest pain globus chocking regurgitation stomach pain right side pain behind central breast bone bowel and bladder symptoms. Palpitations and weight loss can all be symptoms