LS with vaginal infection? Related or not?

Women's health
1

Hi all, last month I was diagnosed with lichen planus on my scalp. It was a condition that my doctor had been unsuccessfully treating, I thought it was really bad dandruff-until my hair began falling out. Saw a dermatologist 3 weeks ago, he looked at my scalp for a minute, diagnosed me, gave me some meds and rescheduled me for one month later.

Meanwhile, 2 days ago I began having burning pain when urinating. This morning, I woke up with a vaginal infection of some kind and a blister resembling a canker sore on the inner part of my inner labia.

Obviously, I'm going to the ER to find out what it is. I had a group B strep infection 4 years ago and the symptoms are similar, except that never presented with an open sore. I'm scared to take anti-biotics, as I'm trying to detox the yeast out of my body.

I'm wondering, for those of you with lichen sclerosus - Is it possible for LS to cause a vaginal infection? I have cloudy discharge that does not smell right, and swelling of my labia, along with cramping. I'm wondering if the lichen planus on my scalp migrated down south, or if this is some other condition? ANY input appreciated! Can lichen sclerosus cause a vaginal infection that is NOT a yeast infection?

2

LS is never inside the vagina, but lichen planus is and you already have a diagnosis of LP. I'd be in that ER now, if I were you. Good luck and keep us posted.

3

It does sound like Vaginal Lichen Planus, with thrush.  Try to speak with someone who is familar and understands this condition, if that is not possible then you need to find a Vulva Clinic in your area.

4

Hi Amy

Sorry you have LP but try not to get to stressed about it, only makes it worse but I know how difficult it is, I have it to.

How old are you Amy only a lot of these problems start after the menopause, I was diagnosed about 14 years ago but didn't have any symptoms then, it was my dentist that diagnosed it but the last couple of years I have had this burning mouth and itchy scalp I am now 57 also I had abnormal cells after a cervical smear and some treatment I noticed they were both diagnosed at the same time Xx have you had any problems with smear test Amy Xx

5

It sounds like LS to me.

Go to the doctors asap.

It can be managed.

6

Me again, just finally leaving for the ER. I am in the US. I'm 39 years old and the LP on my scalp began one year ago, but wasn't diagnosed until 3 weeks ago. This is not sexually related, so that doesn't leave many things this can be. Doctors here are very ignorant to certain things, like candida and what it can do. Even newly diagnosed, I feel I know more than my dermatologist cared to share with me. Thank you all for replying, I will be back either way. It might not be until tomorrow, the ER will likely take many hours.

7

Oh My Freakin' Gosh! I went to the ER and waited over four hours for a bed. It took a total of 8 hours. I told them of my vaginal symptoms, recent LP diagnosis, history of non-pregnant group B strep, and that I am also a sexual assault survivor of 4.5 years. A CNP examined me and declared I had genital herpes!

I am not easily offended and have no problem speaking, in proper medical terminology, about my history and conditions. I underwent extensive, some would say obbsessive, STD/STI testing for over a year after I was assaulted. All negative, thankfully. My current partner of over 3.5 years is my only partner since, and I insisted he be tested too, twice. After multiple clean tests, I think it's fairly safe to say, I don't have that disease.

They refused to to any blood workup, stating no medical need. The did an STD panel-negative. Takes longer for herpes results, they say. They said the Er was for life threatening situations, this wasn't one, so go find the appropriate doctors. Gyno, dermatologist.

In the end, the doctor, upon my third exam, said it wasn't serious, might not be herpes, or very mild.???  White count elevated slightly. He was going to give me comfort meds and gyno referral. The nurse dischared me with instructions on how to wash properly and care for herpes, along with some medicine for herpes. They said, take it or don't, it will go away anyway. Told me to use vaseline for comfort!

I'm certain they are all completely ignorant, and that I have a minor outbreak of lichen-something, or group B strep is returning...but they didn't test for that. At the very least, I think it's sugar related and want to get healthy. I had no idea women were suffering from this awfulness. I already lost a lot of hair to LP, I need to get well!

8

Hi Amy

I am really sorry to hear of your distress.

I am sure they can do a proper test for genital herpes.  My son unfortunately picked it from someone a while ago and has been freaking out ever since.  He is on anti viral drugs from the doctors which he takes every day.  They don't consider it serious and they are almost dismissive about it.  I would get a second opinion and some tests for it.  

I have LS and at first thought it could be genital herpes but it isn't that.  There is a social stigma attached to herpes which is not fair.  Anyone can get it even if you don't sleep around.  The hospital should be able to tell the difference between LS and genital herpes?  

I am changing my diet to reduce sugar drastically as I have constant thrush with LS. Try and do that first if LS is your problem.

You could go to a gum clinic and they know exactl how to diagnose conditions?

9

Here in the UK it is normal to wait 4 hours or more in ER (we call it A & E) as it is very difficut often to get a doctor's appointment.  However after years of thrush and soreness and splitting down below I was eventually referred a few years ago to a combined gynae/vulval clinic which only took place every couple of months in a hospital in another town.  There I was seen by two gynaecologists together with a dermatologist.  They decided my problem was psoriasis and I won't go into the horrendous treatment given.  But only last year when the soreness got worse I was referred back to the combined gynae/vulval clinic where I saw one gynaecologist and the same dermatologist and they decided it was lichen planus and not psoriasis.  Even the experts don't seem to be very sure!  Definitely the advice was cut down or cut out sugar and yeast products, don't use any perfumed products, wash with Aqueous cream, keep the area dry and cool (not tight jeans), and I was given steroid cream (Dermovate).  I also have ichthyosis, psoriasis, allergies, and my father had asthma, and apparently all these things are related.  I have been very grateful to find many helpful suggestions on this site for keeping the lichen planus area moisturised and comfortable.  Do keep persevering with the doctors over there to get a diagnosis.  I am amazed so many women have similar problems - It's not something discussed much as it's so embarrassing.

10

I had symptoms like yours when I was 23 diagnosed as herpes. Odd thing is, I haven't had another sore like that in 42 years, so theymust have misdiagnose5d me. There was no blood test. My GP diagnosed visually.

11

Genital herpes is often confused with LS.  You need a Vulva clinic.

12

You all are great! I used to love internet forums back before facebook took over the world, I'm surprised to have come across a good forum. I know almost nothing about healthcare in the UK, so forgive my ignorance.

Here in the US, in Ohio especially, which happens to be where I live, healthcare has gone from good to horrible in the last several years. I believe it comes from two things. Our food and drug administration is restricting access to pain medication, to combat "abuse." Well, abusers are still abusing their drugs and doctors have become like secretaries here in Ohio. They have to chart and document every single thing they do to justify how they do their jobs. The government watches over what they prescribe, and each doctor needs to be within a pre-defined range. Like, a doctor can have X% of patients being treated with narcotics, but if the number were to rise to something higher, he gets "red-flagged" by the drug enforcement agency.

Our new system of government healthcare has affected our care also. Insurance companies are now required to insure anyone, regardless of their medical history. We are required to buy health insurance, or get it for free if qualified, by income. The premiums are so high, that people feel like they need to "use" their money. Like my partner, he paid $7500 for healthcare plan with a $2000 deductible. So, in order for the plan to pay anything, he first has to pay $2000 for care, then their partial coverage pays most of the rest. So, after dropping $7500 on health insurance, he decided to shape up his health. He's been seeing doctors of all kinds, all year, to improve his health. Many other people do this too, because why not? They bought it and paid for it, why not use it?

Well, these people are not wrong in using what they have paid for, but it's causing the entire network of insurers to end up losing money. In turn, they require more documentation for proof of necessity for simple procedures. So, again, the doctors are now typing away at a keyboard rather than actually listening and examining during the 10-20 minutes you get.

I am just now reading the first post correctly, I thought it said something else. So LP can appear in the vagina? It sure looks like tiny bit of LS in medical photos and I'm ignorant to the difference between the two. I would just liken it to go away!

I sincerely apologize for invading the forum with this, I'm just scared. I truly believe that lichen-something is responsible for this infection, which is mild right now, but I'm terrified of getting group B strep active again. Maybe I should be posting in lichen planus forum?

I thought, as did my doctor, that the ER could get the testing and treatment started and give me something for pain. This wouldn't be such a big deal if the holiday wasn't backed up to the weekend. My misfortune to get a serious infection on the eve of a holiday weekend. Should I just allow it to fester until business hours? Good grief. Oh, and they told me to use vaseline for pain relief. I'm afraid to put anything on it, so I guess ibuprofen will have to suffice. Thank you all for your kindness in replying.

I have seen a naturopath for lichen planus. He was the one who educated me to the real cause. I knew yeast could do some awful stuff, but I really had no idea. I sure do love my carbs and sweet treats, but even the New year's cookies have gone out with the trash! I'm allowing myself 1/2 teaspoon of sugar with coffee and that's it! I still have a lot of research to do and need to read the pinned post, but so grateful to have found this forum. Thanks for following my rant.

13

Sorry for the horrendous time you are having! The ER sadly, would be the last place to go here in NZ too. The doctors are mostly house surgeons and registrars, in other words still training, and you would be last on their list to see as they would deem it non urgent. They also wouldn't even recognise it. My own GP had never seen a case and hardly knew what to do with me. I have changed dr now and see a dermo and gynae. You must get specialist care or be lucky enough to have a very clued up doctor.

vaseline will provide a coating for your vulval area and protect it from urine burns. It's not a treatment.

Yes, LP unfortunately invades the vulval area and vagina and the mouth. I have both but stay on this forum for advice on my genital issues, as the other LP forum mainly discusses oral LP, I find. The treatment on vulval LP and LS is almost identical and most soothing remedies help a lot. The ladies are very supportive. 

Things will get better. Take care.

14

Hello

I don't think LS can cause a vaginal infection, other than thrush!  Perhaps you have thrush?  That smells funny and has a discharge.  I am just getting over an awful bout of it!  Use a Canesten pessary and see if that helps.  If not, you should visit a doctor.

 

15

Hi Lynne 

I have both it was my dentist that found mine years ago didn't know I had it then but recently have all the burning my mouths a nightmare I am 57 and think after the menopause is when it starts I also had a problem with abnormal cervical cells when I was younger, did you have any problems with smears how old are you 

16

Hi,

Sorry to hear about what you're going through. I was scared I had herpes a few months ago, I was excruciatingly sore down there and my skin was really itchy, it was tearing and then thick layers of skin began peeling off. I noticed a sore that was round and looked like a herpes sore so I went to the doctor. Blood tests for STDs and herpes all came back negative.

Initially I was misdiagnosed with lichen planus and thrush, but then when I went to see the vulval skincare specialist (reputedly very good and she lived up to that reputation) she said straight away that it was lichen sclerosus (pale shiny skin, no hint of labia minora whatsoever, clit almost completely disappeared- no exaggeration. I just thought it was different but normal). Getting thrush when you have LS is just awful- it's what caused my symptoms.

Normal thrush medication didn't work for me, the pessary and creams just had no effect. The only thing that worked was a proper course of fluconazole pills, which I took for I think a week.

Now, I avoid antibiotics like the plague and drink probiotic yoghurt drinks (my sister is a diatetics student and says they often actually prescribe Actimel) and that helps keep everything in check- helps with my IBS too.

While waiting for the thrush pills to work, applying vaseline before peeing really helped and taking shallow baths with bicarbonate of soda seemed to help too.

Hope this helps!

17

Like you Netflix, I had undiagnosed thrush exacerbating things for months. My dermatologist gave me the Fluconazole pill (I just had one, it's meant to work for weeks, NZ here so bound to be different treatments and strengths etc) and finally some relief. I am to take one every month.  

I had no discharge, itch or odour so impossible for me to know. It's not the symptoms like thrush I used to get when younger sometimes. Just burning.

She said not to use the canesten or similar cream or pessaries as they could cause more problems. I guess we have enough creams and whatnots going on down there already.

i take a probiotic every day and never touch sugars except the ones in fruit and veggies. 

Opposite to you I had a diagnosis of LS for 15 months before deeming a dermo in vulval health who diagnosed me with LP before examination. I knew my mirror didn't reflect what the lichen sclerosis photos showed! Quite a confusing condition and seems to effect everyone differently in some way or another. 

 

18

 I'm going to update my saga in a minute, but thank you for your input. I believe this will be true for me as well. Side by side comparisions, there are more indicators of LP than H. I know it's not yeast or thrush, having suffered from that many times.

I too, avoid antibiotics like the plague. 4 years ago, when I had non-pregnant group B strep in my blood and caused a vaginal infection, among other issues. Having creeped into my blood, I had no choice but to "just take one round of amoxicillion" which turned into large doses of Cipro and other broad-spectrum antibiotics. But, I got well.

Soon after, the yeast infections began, along with fluconozole pills. Over a period of about 1.5 years, related or not, I had gone from eating a very clean diet to gorging on carbs, refined food and wine. I didn't see an association when it first began, and I actually lost weight. I didn't have much extra weight, so losing it made me very happy. Suddenly I found myself wearing skinny jeans AND eating sugar and carbs, so I buried my head in the sand. Sad, I know. Now I have lichen planus and had to make an immediate, drastic change.

May I ask, what is Actimel? I just began a heavy probiotics regimine. I really believe the yeast must be controlled to control LP. I have almost every symptom of candida overgrowth and LP is further confirmation. What is a normal dose/round of fluconazole pills where you live? Here, for yeast infections, they give one 150mg pill. That usually does the trick, but often it returns 2-6 times before finally going away. Maybe one pill isn't enough?

I'm sorry you also went through the herpes misdiagnosis.  Of course, I'm glad you don't have another disease. But it's sad, in 2016, there is still such a huge stigma attached. See my update shortly, as I saw another doctor yesterday. Thanks for your reply and best wishes to you to keep that yeast in check!

19

Yesterday, still suffering with symptoms, I went to what we call "urgent care" or "walk-in clinics." They are supposed to be for non-life threatening emergencies, when your regular doctor is unavailable. Mostly, they are useless in my area. They are extremely conservative in any treatments, and generally not the top of the class students don't work in them. They are known for incompentency and extended wait times, which was part of my reason for going to the ER-they are fully equipped to deal with anything.

Anyway, I got lucky and there was only one patient there. Wait time was nothing, and I lucked out and got an old man doctor. The nurse had never even heard of lichen planus, but the doctor knew some about it. After listening to my history, my ER horror story, and examining me, he said the ER was wrong to diagnose me without testing me for it! I didn't know they never ran a test for herpes. The freakin' ER diagnosed me with herpes, only tested for a handful of other STD/STI's-but never tested for herpes!

Once we got past that, there was a language barrier. The doctor was Chinese and had a heavy accent. Luckily, he was patient and didn't mind re-explaining and helping me figure out what he was saying. He also conversed with me, medically, at the highest level I could understand, rather than give vague answers. He said it could be any number of things causing my symptoms and that it could very well be lichen planus, or herpes, or something else...that lab testing can easily confirm or deny, but that the test had to be done! So, he tested me for herpes and I'll have the results at the end of the week. He also tested for several other things. My GP will finish the rest of the testing this week.

So, that was the good news of the visit. The bad news was, he wanted me to take a broad-spectrum antibiotic and an anti-viral medicine until the lab could process the tests. So, I was left with a choice of taking a bunch of medicine without knowing if I actually needed it or not, OR just waiting on lab tests all week, which was the whole reason why my doctor wanted me to go to the ER to begin with-get the right medicine working right away. I decided to wait, I can't risk a candida problem. LP is spreading on my scalp. For over a year, it was one area, about the size of a quarter. Since being diagnosed, it's grown much larger and continues moving out. I am going bald! My infection seems to be healing on it's own, and the blister is just kind of lingering. No pain or itching. Hopefully, it's not serious. One positive though, he at least gave me some lidocaine gel I can use on it! So, unlike the ER, he did lab testing to determine the cause of "vaginitis." He gave me medicine to treat most likely causes, even though I don't think it's likely that my problem falls into the "likely" category. He gave me pain relief gel. Completely opposite to what the ER said and did. At least I'll have some answers from that, and thank you Jesus, it is finally Monday!!! I can go see my regular doctor, who is gold! Thank you all for your support.

 

20

Hello all, tests are back and no herpes... NOW, days later, they suggest I see a doctor. Really? Why didn't I think of that? Thank you Jesus, my real doctor is back on duty and the weekend from heck can go back there! I'm reasonably certain it's LS or LP. I've started a whole cleanse of my body and went on a paleo diet. Infection seems to be clearing while I waited for help, and the mystery sore is gone.