Sorry that this is rather long but I came upon this forum after researching this painful condition and thought if anyone would understand, fellow sufferers might, as they would appear to be the "experts" in this little understood condition!
I started with shoulder pain about 4 months ago and after eventually realising my problem was getting worse and wasn't going to get better on it's own, I visited my GP a couple of weeks ago and was diagnosed with a frozen shoulder. He gave me a load of painkillers (with limited effect) and recommended physio. As we have Bupa via my other half's job, I was able to bypass the 12 week NHS waiting list and organise this straight away. I was given the name of a couple of local clinics and chose one that specifically mentioned the treatment of frozen shoulders on it's web site.
I went for my first physion session last Monday and was treated by a nice and sympathetic young woman, who examined me and asked lots of questions. She explained the condition and the need to try to get my shoulder working a bit better before doing some manipulation and recommending some simple stretching to start with, using a hot water bottle to get the blood flowing, etc. She recommended my next session be in a few days and I was booked in for the Friday. Unfortunately this physio was on leave on the Friday but she said I'd be fine with one of her colleagues.
When I arrived for my next session there was some discussion between staff about "swapping sessions" - turns out they were referring to me and I ended up with a different physio from the one I'd booked with. The session started late (30 minute session) and I was then left with my shoulder under a heat lamp for a further 10 minutes. The physio then returned, checked my movements, did a little manupulation and showed me a couple of exercises. He seemd very negative in pointing out the lack of movement in my bad shoulder, re-iterated the "stages" of frozen shoulder and the long time each stage could take, saying he wanted to set my expectations. He said he saw little point in me coming too often for sessions - totally the opposite of what the original physion had said. After the negative way he spoke, I really felt as if I was wasting my time - and his! After months of pain and lack of sleep I was feeling rather fragile - I've done enough research into the condition to know not to expect an overnight cure but at least thought I was doing something positive. He burst that bubble and left me feeling distraught. Not wanting to show myself up infront of him, I managed to keep myself composed and managed to make it back to my car before bursting into tears.
My hubby was furious and said I should complain to both the clinic and Bupa - after all, the treatment is being paid for. I do have an appointment in a weeks time with the original physio, who seemed nice - but I'd be very uncomfortable about going back to that practice, if I'd complained about one of her colleagues. Meanwhile I have also been reading about the Niel-Asher Technique (NAT) and found a clinic not too far away who have physios trained in this and am wondering if this might be worth a try. Bupa originally authorised 5 physio sessions but said they'd consider more, if needed. As I've already used up 2, I'm wondering if it is better to change at this stage or if I might be jumping from the frying pan into the fire! Any experience of conventional physio vs the Niel-Asher Technique would be particualrly welcome. Any other tips on managing this condition would also be welcome.
Hi Maria, I have had injections, surgery and have tried a couple of different physio's over a 15 month period with very limited sucess including long periods of work. This is a condition that that does not respond positively to many treatments but in saying this everyone is different and reacts differently to these treatments, so is always a good idea to give it a go. Even the different specialist have different ideas and treatment.
I really hope you feel better soon and you find a really supportive doctor to help you on this journey
Morning, I went down the physio route for months. It cost me a small fortune. I had a cortisone injection which had no effect at all.
Its a bloody awful condition which I dont think anyone can understand unless they have had it.
Eventually I had surgery. I am following this with quite aggresive physio and am getting a reasonable range of movement. The gut wrenching pain when I knocked my arm has gone. Still have some pain in my arm but this is improving as I get a bit of muscle tone back. I think as other people say, there are lots of different opinions on treatment. I have suggested this before but I think its worth repeating. The chap that did my op, has a website The London Upper Limb Unit.
Have a look through and see his opinion on when to do physio. Its working for me. Good luck
Hi Maria, I am also a user of Bupa due to the lack of support form my GP and being told nothing wronhg. Just have pain and it will go away that was an NHS physio. I shelled out of 2k for a private osteo who kept advising to see specialist but I did not want surgery. Pain got the better of me and sleep deprevation. I contacted my GP and asked for a referal to a consultant at a BMI hosptial.All it need was for the GP to fax over a letter to BUPA and then I was on my way. I have never looked back,although I am not cured I am better than I was. Still awake at night and in constant pain but managable. No treatment is guarranteed and the physio's will not really know what this pain is all about. I understand why your husband is furious, but reporting it to BUPA will do nothing. They will suggest another physio but to be honest physio does nothing. After 5 sessions where will you go then? Yes you will get anther 5 when the policy renews itself but the wait will be agony. Start sourcing a surgeon. Bupa only cover 3 steroid injections for this and again these do not guarantee they will cure. An MUA may help you or Capsulr release. Both are ok as operations go,quick reocvery. If you have a tear of the tendon then the op is bigger and 6 week recovery before physio starts. All worth reading up on. Physio is not normally done on a weekly session as they expect you to go away and do the exercises and then return and report how things are. Remember you are the paying customer so to speak so do not let them dominate you well being. If you feel it is wrong speak up, it is your right, ask specifically for the lady who made you feel comfortable. Moving on I am not sure it will be the right thing to do.
I did write a very long reply it has just dissapeared so I will cut a long story short. Fall brought on frozen shoulder, very bad treatment at the N.H,S. This all started
Dec. 28th 2014. had to go privately in the end had hydrodilation on May 18th. No pain for 5 weeks. increased movement in arm so could get back to driving, sewing and cycling. The pain did come back a bit. I can live with it now and have accepted it as it does not stop me from doing the things I enjoy. I am surprised you have not been offered this. I live near York and the Nuffield is marvellous there. I am going to be signed off on Nov. 10th by my physio and see how it goes. I might have more hydrodialtion if needed, but at the moment I can cope and hope it will get a lot better in time. I still have to do exercises but not quite so often. I hope this helps.
Hi there so sorry to hear you have been diagnosed with this vile condition I have had his since 2014 December have had 3 cortisone injections the last one finally worked. I tried physio but made it worse I had my last injection in August and thank god the awful mind numbing pain has gone I have limited movement but not a lot of pain now I manage it with pain killers. I try and do small exercises to increase movement some things work others don't I'm sorry to say it's trial and error you have to do what you think will help you. I do know the last injection was an mri guided one and I think this is why it worked. I hope you find a solution very soon. Gentle hugs to you x
You have my total sympathy and empathy. It is an excrutiatingly painful and debilitating condition. I started with one Physio who was very nice but seemed very unsure of my condition - I came out of his office crying twice. I decided to go to another one that I knew of and he sent me for xrays and ultrasound before he would touch me. This told him what he needed to know so he could plan the right treatment. I had severe bursitis, tendinitis and a torn tendon so I was given a steroid injection into the bursa and no physio until this settled after about 3 weeks. The Physio was very gentle and totally understood my condition. He discouraged me from taking pain killers unless I absolutely needed to which I did for a few months. He worked very slowly - I was going to him fortnightly for a couple of months, then monthly and now approximately 1 year on I haven't seen him since July and have been off pain killers since mid year. I go back to the Physio next week. I am so much better than this time last year. He is confident I will be back to normal but he did explain it will take time. I do my exercises daily and try not to overuse the affected arm. Your condition may be different than mine. I would encourage you to seek further advice - ask for scans and x-rays - it hurts but may help. Good Luck
Well the male therapist was correct in that if you really have a frozen shoulder nothing at this stage will help. It takes some time to get a history and a comprehensive examination to come to the right conclusion. GPs are not the best at diagnosing musculoskeletal conditions. In addition don't see a physiotherapist until you vet them. In the UK google Chartered Society of Physiotherapists and then find one who has passed the exams for manual therapy and then make your decision who to consult with. That's what I would do, but I am too old to get this affliction. Similar Societies to the British CSP have web pages in the USofA, Canada, Australia and New Zealand. Perhaps other contries as well. Unfortunately in this day and age any shoulder which has or seems to have lost range gets called a frozen shoulder. You will see all sorts of miracle cures and if they are it was not a FS to begin with.
Thanks to everyone for your replies and support. Not nice to think that so many are going through this painful condition but good to have people who understand. I have decided to go elsewhere for the remainder of my Bupa funded physio sessions and see how it goes from there. I've spoken to the head guy at another clinic (very well qualified) where some of the staff are trained in the Neil-Asher technique. I got the impression they don't entirely buy into it as a "cure" but use what they believe are appropriate elements of his treatment methods. He also mentioned other possible surgical routes that could potentially be recommended and seemed to understand the condition. I've got an appointment for an initial assessment with him next week and will see how that goes and what he recommends.
The assesment of the male physio might have been correct - but his negative attitude ans approach was not. I'm not expecting any overnight cures and know already there are different approaches to how best to treat this - scaring patients off and sending them off in tears doesn't figure high in this. He also wasted half of a 30 minute treatment which after all, even with Bupa, we are paying for. I'll see what this new guy suggests and let you know how I get on.
Best of luck to you Maria. If you are like I was, up for hours during the night trying to find the right sleeping position to circumvent the pain, do remember it will ease - evenutally. I ended up sleeping in a recliner, leaning to the side of my good shoulder so as not to put any pressure at all on the bad shoulder! The slightest jerk, touch or movement was the worst. I even drove with a cushion wedged between the car door and the side of my body to rest my elbow on to keep my arm still. Lucky it wasn't my other arm as I have a munual car... I probably would have not been driving. I recall when I first went to my current Physio, he warned, "this can take up to a year"... I said "pregnancy is only 9 months and childbirth was never this painful"! I look forward to reading about your progress.
Yes, Hydrodialation was mentioned by my consultant along with the operation. He said he would do it if I wanted but did say it is very sore for the patient and the results are not too promising. We decided the best way forward was the op. My right arm is now paralised for next 24-48 hours and a few stitches as before. The consultant has said it is a condition that can go on for years as in my case but he is optomistic for this recovery. He found scar tissue which was catching the shoulder and inflamation. The op longer than expected but he has had good clean up. stitches out in just under two weeks and hydrotherapy starts this Saturday so big push now on the road to recovery. Thanks for everyones support and thoughts. Op was only last night so will keep posting as to the recovery. Best wishes
Frozen shoulder lady here. How painful indeed. Had shoulder decompression which worked and then told by physio I was moving too much and told to watch two films a day and guess what....now got frozen shoulder. Found that Gabapentin has removed the pins and needles and shooting pains which is progress and having gentle pain relief on board I can actually move my arm and in case range daily. Surgery wants to do manipulation under general but am not too sure hat this is the way forward. Seeing an acupuncturist has really helped me too. Stay strong fellow suffers and always have a hot water bottle on shoulder.
I wasted a whole year and money on physio for medication, chiro and physio and deep tissue massage. I was finally fed up and went to an osteopath who teaches physio type exercises and does more than chiro. for half the price. that combined with SHOCK WAVE THERAPY saved my arm. frozen shoulder usually takes years to heal. I am moving my arm after 1 month of intense therapy. a bit pricy but so worth it getting the mobility back. please look into it. there is not a lot out there on it but I am working with the top specialist in canada about it. I am not taking any medication although prescribed. when doing the therapy you cannot take anti inflammatories. I bought Bell roll on pepper cream which helped and put heat. cheers.
Well I went to the new physio yesterday and felt he is someone I can work with. He is a very down to earth older guy who seemed to know his stuff and without offering me false hope, was very suppportive. He did some manipulation - especially on some pressure points and showed me some gentle excercises to try to strengthen my muscles. He did seem to think I was an ideal candidate for Hydrodilation and said he could recommend someone good who could do this. I wanted to avoid anything invasive, if at all possible so said I'd think about it.
After Googling Hydrodilation, I'm more confused than ever! Have found everything from descriptions of how effective it was, through opinions that it's no more effective than cortisone injections and even others suggesting it could cause joint damage. There seem to be so many differing opinions on the effectiveness of all the different treatments for this condition that it's difficult to know where to turn.
Better news is that I think I may be heading into the second stage of this condition. In the last week I've had less aching during the day and when it has ached, it has been less intense. I've even managed a couple of not perfect but semi decent night's sleep with the help of a V-shaped pillow I bought (from Dunelm) and co-codamol. I'm sleeping propped up on my back with my bad arm on a soft feather pillow that I can mould around my arm. I've never liked sleeping on my back but have got used to it. It still hurts like hell if I knock my arm but other than that seems more managable, day to day. Not so good news is that I've had odd aches in my other arm - don't know if this is just that I'm over using it to protect my bad arm but it is worrying.
I'll do some of the suggested (gentle) stretching and strengthening exercises - I was told to stop if it hurts. I have another appointment with the physio in a couple of weeks time and see how that goes. Any thoughts on the Hydrodilation would be welcome.
See my post on what my consultant thinks of Hydrodialation. On his advise and information I went against it, particularly as he said the results are not promising. I do think FS is a matter of what is right for you may not be right for others. I have just had my 3rd op and I am feeling optimistic.
Regarding your coments about the other arm, it could be the over compensating, but it is quite common that the other arm will go down the same route. My consultant said he generally sees people within two years of the first arm suffering for the second arm. Speak to your physio next time. Good to hear you feel more confident with your new physio.
It worked for me, but as you say everybody is diffirent, The thing with hydroditalion it will do no harm and there are no risks attached so I was told by the consultant. I was not prepared to have anything done that may cause a potential risk like steroid injections, acupuncture or operations. Good luck with the results of your third op.