hi, i have changed from DLA where i was on high high, ive received the results of my PIP assessment and theyve decided that im only going to get the standard rates on both. Im really disabled with chronic Rhumatoid and Osteo Arthrirtis and Fibro myalgia, i walk with the aid of crutches and can do for about 20 metres. Im so very worried as i was due to pick my new car next week, but now i wont be able to have one as im not on the advanced rate for mobility, i dont know when they will take my car off me or anything. i sit here crying as i will never be able to afford my own car, and i just wont be able to go out anywhere. I would be really grateful for any help or advice,
thank you, Damara.
HI damara, i'm sorry to hear this. Your first step would be to ask for a Mandatory Reconsideration (MR). You'll also need to ask for a copy of the assessment report, if you haven't already done this. You only have 1 month from the date on the letter to get the MR in so please be quick. As for your car motability will be in contact with you and arrange for it to be returned within about about 6 weeks from the date of the decision. Don't give up and good luck.
This doesn't surprise me a bit. For a start the distance limit for DLA to get the highest rate was 50 metres, but for PIP it is no more than 20 metres. That has caused a lot of problems for many people - 500 cars a week are having to be handed back at the moment.
It's all about making the argument for your case and getting good quality evidence to support your argument that 20 metres distance is the maximum.
I was tested in the Spinal unit at hospital on a treadmill a few years back and the consultant said up to 50 metres was my max - now using that as evidence would have shot me in the foot if I was looking to get Enhanced from the High Mobility that I had under DLA.
So you have to find similar evidence that backs up the new 20 metre rule.
As has been said you must do a MR and if you can, supply new evidence.
It is highly unlikely that the DWP will change their mind in any event so get preparing for your day in court.
Hi
Can you contact a company in your local area. I never had DLA. I have only had pip but It's looking like I'm in the same boat as you. A company local to me help full on forms and fight your case. They have more chance of winning than we would doing it alone. The company I use are all funded so it's free of charge. They have trip in cebtres for you to attend. Please seek help before sending in your M.R
Good luck x
Hi Damara,
Please read all of the replies so far as they are full of good advice. I have to be honest with you there is no quick fix to your situation and to get the decision reversed you will have to follow the DWP procedures by asking for a Mandatory Reconsideration and then a Tribunal if that fails.
The trick is to persuade the DWP or a Tribunal that on the balance of probabilities the decision is wrong. Probably your biggest hurdle is the Assessment report and as Denise advised get a copy. Once you have that go through it and see where you can challenge the Health Care Professional's opinion using any credible medical evidence you have to swing the balance of probabilities in your favor. If you don’t have any evidence then obtain it by getting medical reports from your hospital files or get your GP to write a letter of support.
This is not an easy procedure and if you can get help then use it as advised by Clare and remember the appeal deadlines.
Unfortunately you are not alone and as Les posted 500 disabled people per week are in the same situation as yourself. I understand how upsetting this is for you but sitting in your kitchen crying won’t change anything. You have to summon the strength to fight this or put it behind you and adjust to your new circumstances.
Hi, could I ask what is the 'company' that you mention? It may well help others who have no choice but to 'go it alone'.
Hi everyone, thank you all for the help. This morning I phoned PIP and said that most of the information provided by my interviewer was completely wrong. The lady asked if i would like to have my decision explained to me by a case manager and I would have the opportunity to put my information right.... Of course i said yes and she said someone would ring me within 24 hours.
This afternoon the case manager phoned me, we went through their decision point by point and she took the details of what I thought was wrong. At the end she asked me if I wanted her to halt my claim and send it for re assessment which I said yes to.
She did advise me that the decision could go either way and I had 28 days to send my Hospital documents in. Also regarding the car she said it might be worth phoning Motability, explain the situation and see if they would extend the car lease until the reassessment came through, as I'm house bound without one. When I asked how long this procedure took, she said between 4 and 9 weeks.
I now feel so much more confident and I'm going to fight this decision all the way........
Good on you. Keep fighting them. And good luck. Let us know how you get on x
All I can say to that is that you are only very lucky dude!
Not because they were polite but that they actually rang you back within just a few hours and were decent and listened to what you said.
You must have had a Case Manager that was feeling extremely happy for some reason.
The general opinion is that they never ring back.
One ring me back within hours
She was very nice. But unfortuanately wasn't the one on my case. She was the one that earned me to go get as much evidence now . So I'm ready for the MR.
I just wish was doing my case. There at some lovelybpnes that work for the dwp but sadly what they write doesnt always match how they come across.
You do sound like you managed to get a good one Damara
As an example and I think my memory is accurate, I was attempting to claim Pension Credit back in late 2009. I won't go into what happened but from memory, over the period from March 2010 to February 2011, I actually sent the DWP over 42 letters and made 38 telephone calls. I never received a call back from them and only received one letter in reply.
I had a similar problem with my ESA claim, it dragged on from September 2009 untl the following May before I received a penny from them, they lost 3 claim forms (2 of which were duplicates) never returned any telsphone calls with me chasing up the money and over a dozen letters.went unanswered. My claim had to be re-built clerically as so many mistakes had been made by them. I actually had to return a giro cheque to them in Feb 2010 as it was for an amount that was way above what I knew I was entitled to.
So yes those like yourself should count themselves very lucky.
You were a victim of the time (2009 onwards) Les where public opinion turned against those claiming benefits. Slowly things have moved on and if our new Prime Minister is to be believed then everyone (including benefit claimants) will be given a fair chance.
We'll have to see if this is a real change of course by the Government or just a flash in the pan.
I did. And I was very shocked that firstly they did call me back and secondly it was within an hour.
Sadly that seems to be the only thing that has gone right so far.
I think it maybe area dependant also. My area maybe a little more helpful. Like the group that I am going to. Although I agree it should be rolled out for everyone in our position.
I guess it's the same debate as people have with medical issues. It's a post code lottery. Very sad for alot of people. I myself have been on the end of this and had to pay private to get some help for my condition on several occasions.
Sorry you had all the trouble . It's a shame you didn't have the help
Hi Damara
Really glad you have decided to fight your corner.
However, as I said it is still a tough fight and one polite DWP case worker doesn't make a successful appeal.
That said you have done the correct thing and started gaining medical evidence. Don't forget your care evidence which is supporting letters from anyone who provides you with personal care such as cooking meals/helping you bathe/help get in or out of the bath tub or shower/help dress/help undress or help with social interaction.
With your mobility the assessor has probably come to the conclusion you can walk more than 20 meters but no more than 50 meters using an aid (your crutches). This is why you now receive standard rather than enhanced mobility.
Possible ways of challenging this are;
1. The distance is incorrect.
2. You can’t walk the distance ‘safely’ ‘repeatedly’ or within a reasonable timescale (twice the time it would take a non-disabled person)
3. The HCP has failed to take in the fact you need someone with you when venturing out to ‘prompt you to follow a route or journey’. This would have gained you another 4 points and that would have qualified you for enhanced mobility.
On each of these points you will need medical evidence which can be linked to your disability. With point 2 if it takes you twice the time to walk 20 meters that it does for a non-disabled person then according to the legislation that is your maximum distance. If you can walk that distance but repeatedly stumble, fall or lose balance then your maximum distance is less than 20m also. If you can walk 20m but can’t repeat the procedure due to physical exhaustion again your maximum distance is 20m.
If you need someone with you on a journey it is generally connected to Mental Health issues. So if you suffer with MH then get the evidence and explain why you need someone with you when venturing outside. This descriptor isn’t strictly restricted to MH if you can prove on the balance of probabilities that you need someone for some other reason then again you would score the 4 points.
gulp!! even though I am a part time politician (unpaid town councillor) I don't believe anything that any politician in Westmister says.
What with the changes to ESA coming on board and the way that those who are sick and in the Support Group are going to be treated I do have my doubts that any minister wants to see the sick given a 'fair chance'.
The policy of this government is to maximise income (everybody should be working and paying there own way) and reducing any sort of welfare dependency. Add to that the reductions in spending (even now considering getting rid of the guaranteed annual increases to the State Pension, getting rid of Pension Credit, fiddling once again with PIP to make it even harder to qualify etc etc ) to make it possible for those who are on a high income and have high capital wealth to not only see effective tax reductions but also to pass on more tax free wealth on death.
For me this country should get rid of the House of Lords and take power away from MP's and pass it to the local authorities and even town councils for them to decide how they want their areas to be funded.
At least local authority control would mean greater scrutiny by those that live in that area.
There was and still isn't any help available. Unfortunately for me and a lot of other people, we live in a wealthy area of the South East. That doesn't mean to say that everybody that lives there has the same level of wealth. House prices are ridiculous for example. I find that in these types of areas, very few advice centres are available. You only have to look at some of the more deprived areas in England where there are an abundance of centres set up to help with problems. In fact the South East does not have a Law Centre staffed by volunteer solicitors. The only available one to cover such a large area is in the West of London.
Consequently it is assumed that being in the South East everyone should have the funds to pay for legal advice.
Well put Anthony,
The major problem that I had and presumably there must be many many more in the same boat is going from HRM - DLA to ERM - PIP.
For years the mark of gaining HRM DLA was that the distance had to be under 50 metres. Evidence would have been sought confirming this. Then down the line (maybe a year or two later) you can't realistically use that same evidence to gain ERM - PIP. You need new evidence to counter what you claimed previously - walking distance has reduced from under 50 metres to less than 20 metres.
If you are attempting to argue the safety or speed angles then that would be a challenge if it was clear with the DLA claim that you didn't argue that then but now are changing the argument that it does now.
For new PIP claims (never having claimed DLA previously) life is made easier as there are no comparisons to make.
Good point Les it is a challenge with regard to DLA>PIP Mobility. That said many DLA claimants haven't been assessed for years even decades so the argument of change in condition is a creditable one.
Also what exactly counts as evidence? Does it actually need a distance to be specifically noted on a document or is a diagnosis of 'pain' enough? I often think of the HCP receiving an MRI scan of someone’s back and wondering how the hell are they supposed to interpret it?
I myself live in a nice area but it is classed as a less fortunate area of England so you are probably right. That is why our mps make sure there is finding so this group can help people. I live on the boarder of 2 areas and only one area had the help. So that shows how it varies I guess
Yes what actually does count as evidence for the Mobility factor?
Unless you are able to get a specific OT or maybe a Consultant to confirm this you would have had to undergo tests such as the treadmill. I think that you will be hard pushed to prove whether the max. distance is 18/20 or even 23 metres. Then pain? Who could prove or disprove when pain sets in, at what level etc? There are no practical tests that can be done to establish this. Speed? I can go as slow as I need or as fast as I want.who is there to prove that?
Then a MRI/X-Ray/CT - digital result. Who actually have these at home and besides which who has the software to use them.Even hospitals in different area Trusts have difficulting reading each others scans.
Then the written results - again who have these at home? If they do, how can they be intrepreted by the assessor? They obviously will describe the findings but trying to put that to say - pain claimed whilst walking is very subjective.
Looking at pain itself, does a copy of the repeat prescription prove anything? Yes medication has been authorised for pain but what is the provable pain level. It's no good arguing that - hey I am on a high dose of Morphine so you must accept that my pain is with me 24/7 and reaches 9.5 on the pain scale every day. That doesn't prove a thing. More and more I hear of people becoming savvy to window dressing their condition. Actually ordering their pain relief every month so as to make the records look that they are in agony 24/7 but throwing the meds away!
I think that it is a mixture of all of this and in the right combination it could be used as evidence to support a mobility issue. Having said all of that the claim form and the evidence must be believable.