Hello men. This is mainly something that I have been think about. With all the procedures out there we have to pick which is the best for our problem. Some Urologist will only offer you one procedure and it mainly turp. That is because that is all they know. It may fix the problem but sometime I have read on here that a few men had it 3 or more time. If it did not work why put youself through it again. And there are so many side effect you have do deal wiith. The most the men are saying is retro ejaculation. If you can deal with it fine but when they offer it to someoone in there 40's. I don't think it's fair. I don't know if any of you have ever had a dry orgasm but it sucks. I was on a pill last year and was not prepared for it. I was watching porn and just relaxing and you know. I had the orgasm but nothing came out. They tell you it's the same but it hurt and so did my bladder. Read up on it and that was a side effect of the pill. Talked to my doctor and that is when we picked the uro-lift. It worked fine for me. On no pills and I sleep through the night. I just would like men to make sure you are aware of any side effects with any procedure you pick. Make sure you get all the information you can before you have anything done because there is no going back. Also don't be bullied into any procedure. Take care and good hearth Ken
All good points. I had the PAE and it has been awesome. I had the TURP as well 2 plus years ago and it did not work, and it sucked big time. Your right Urologists can be bullies about it. One of the urologogists that I saw befoere the TURP was a bully and never mentioned the possible side effects. Thanks,
Bill
Thanks. That is why I say have something else before the turp because you can't go back..Take care Ken ( They come up with there will be know change and it will be all the same. That is alot of bull )
There are so many abreviated procedures out there that it becomes alphabet soup and most are not available in all areas. No one knows in advance which procedure will work best as all mens bodies act differently. Some of the newer procedures which have great initial results have an unknown future longevity and physicians do not to put themselves into a position of going along with a procedure that has an unknown future. For this reason they will stick with the gold standard or rather the old standard of TURP.
Ken: Also don't be bullied into any procedure
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Amen. And this can be difficult when you're in distress and the guy in the white coat is telling you that his operation is the only thing that can fix it. 9 out of 10 times they're wrong because like you said, there are choices, but sometimes you have to go to another doctor to get that option since the choices you get are usually limited to whatever procedure your doctor performs.
And also don't forget self-catherization (CIC) which was my choice. It's not a popular choice mainly I think because so few doctors tell their patients about the option. I passed on the TURP operation and opted for CIC for 2 1/2 years. Looking back I'm convinced I made the right choice.
Jim
Thank you Ken, Jim, Bob, Chuck, Charles and countless other brothers who have contributed immensely to this forum. Your contributions, believe it or not are a million times more informative than what I learned from over four "expert" (urologists) I've consulted over a period of more than 12 years.
Quite honestly, I strongly believe that if these experts could humble themselves, they just might learn a thing or two by coming to this forum to gain first hand knowledge of what's going on with their guinea pigs a.k.a 'we the patients'.
That's right, we the ones that really know how it feels to have catheter or not have one, what it feels like to shoot blank bullets, what it feels like to know that we were lied into believing that the only option available is the almighty TURP. To not be informed of UROLIFT, PAE, TUMT, HOLEP, TUVP, Vaporization of the Bladder Neck, Laser and Microwave procedures. There are lots more. At the very least, they should have had the decency to inform us of a more advanced version of their infamous TURP, i.e. the Bipolar TURP or Biploar Transurethral Vaporization.
Anyway, pardon my rants, I'm just elated to find this site. I was just on my way to the knife for TURP until I accidentally found this site and here I am seven days after I first heard about UROLIFT and Biploar Vaporization, I had my UROLIFT procedure.
Anyway, I'm sleepy and would share details of my pre-op and post-op experience.
Just happy to announce that 10 days after undergoing UROLIFT and Bipolar Vaporization of the bladder neck, I feel like I've never felt in more than 12 years. I even slept 4 hours without interruption last nite. This is from a guy that woke up every hour pre surgery! Also consider that my bladder neck was also elongated.
Will share details in my updates.
Sam
Turp is the standard but when you have to do it 2 or 3 times whats the point...Ken
I am glad for you I have a friend that has been doing it for over 10 years . He just said he had to get use to it..Take care Ken
Sam I am happy for you. Life is to short to give up anything. I told my urologist about this sight. He never know there was one. He said that is very good and he will look into it sometimes Happy healing Ken If you would like to know anything just ask. Had my urolift 6 month's ago
Thank you for your update on your good result of a modern method.
Urologists often baffle me with their attitudes and lack of concern for their patients. With TURP and Laser procedures they more or less can be certain of regrowth and many tell patients to start on Avodart to stop regrowth right after their procedure.
Do you know of a procedure which is the longest lasting of all outside of permanent catherization?
With looking at the research. Uro-lift and PAE are new both are under 10 years old but all of the research looks good. Lester look into them and fine a good doctor. You will know which is right for you Ken
Hi Jim and the other guys posting here.
I thought it was about time I updated you with my current position after everyone here has been so helpful with their experiences.
I hope all the other people on the other threads I have read and posted on will also see this?
IF you remember I had 2 episodes of Acute Retention and had to put up with an indwelling catheter from 28th July this year until 11th September.
I was unaware previously that I had any problem let alone BPH; however after several DRE and Ultrasound I was confirmed to have BPH with my prostate measuring at 48CC. and pushing into Bladder and squeezing my Urethra. I was offered Green Laser PVP and given a date of 6th OCtober!!!!
THis was all a bit too sudden for me, and I wanted another go at peenig on my own and to learn Self CAth (after reading Jim James posts).
THe hospital was fine with this and on 11th September I went to a clinic at Hinchingbrooke Hospital in Cambs and had the Folet cath removed at 12 midday,
The nurse said quite simply off you go and start drinking normally, dont over do it. Come back at 4pm and we will see how you are getting on.
I drove home with some trepidation as you might imagine having not peed on my own for nearly 2 months. (aprt from 24 hours on 14th August after which I developed a bad UTI and went into AUR again).
I am happy to report I peed ok and went back to the Hospital at 4pm. THe nurse measured my PVR which was 82 ml. She said you will be fine but I insisted on her teaching me to self cat which she did and gave me a supply of disposable caths. I found the Tamsulosin prescribed did nothing for me apart from give me a headache and mild Retro Ejaculation. So I knocked that on the head and self prescribed SAw PAlmetto, Pumkin seed oil and Stinging Nettle Root Extract. (I have been taking since mid August, so dont actually know whether its working as I had cath removed on 11th Sep!)
All I know is I can pee ok, and it has improved over the last month, from peeing 15-20 times a day to a more normal 7-10 (depending obviously on what and how much I drink) and once during the night on average. (I have not had to self cath once!) So on the basis of this I have cancelled my GL surgery and as a result of extensive googling and from posts on this forum have located a trial for Prostate Aterial Embolisation (just googel UK-Rope PAE. There are 18 UK triasl happening right now)
I am going with a Doctor Charles TApping at Oxford NHS hospital UK)
I will keep you posted on how things develop.
Good luck everyone
Jeremy.
Jezz I am very happy for you. I am gled you did not rush in the procedure and your doctors were ok with it. Some are not. Good health my friend Ken
Hi Jeremy,
That's a great report and thanks for updating
! Do you know what your IPSS score is right now? (I don't want to post a link or this post will be moderated but I started a thread by that name in this forum). Because if your IPSS score is not too bad, what is the rush for PAE since you know have acute retention covered since you have learned how to self cath. PAE and the other procedures can only get better as time goes on, so for those that can wait it is something to think about. Also, and I don't know as much about PAE as many here, your prostate at 48cc is on the smaller size of enlarged, so the question is how much will PAE help someone with that size prostate as opposed to someone with a larger one.
Curious, did the nurse just talk your through the self cathing procedure, or did she actually have you do it yourself in the office? If the latter, how did it go? What cath did they give you and what instructions?
Jim
I also think your story demonstrates how many doctor's knee jerk reaction is surgery when certain symptons present. It's up to us as patients to explore other option, often under trying circumstances. It's ironic that a very low tech procedure (Foley or self catherization) is the only thing that gives us the time to explore these options.
Jim
Since your PVR was 82, as you say, no reason to self cath (CIC) because of PVR. That said, you also do not necessarily want to wait for acute retention.
So, now that you have learned this skill, you might want to check your PVR more often. Don't know how it works in the UK, but here in the U.S. I probably could have my PVR checked monthly in my doctor's office by a bladder scanner if I wanted. I think this is especially important since you just came off a Foley which gave your bladder a complete vacation. What you want to see is how the bladder functions post Foley, and again, not wait too long for acute retention.
Depending on what you find, you could leave things alone, or go on a limited schedule of self-catherization. If your PVR is 150 or under, you should be OK without CIC. However if it is over 150, then CIC might benefit bladder health (elasticity, etc.) The other number of interest wouuld be your natural void volume PRIOR to urinating. When you add this with PVR you get your total bladder capacity. I would not use this as an number to take action by but would make note of it for future reference.
You can also check PVR by self catherization, but there is always the small chance of UTI's, so best check by bladder scanner if your're not on a CIC shedule and have a choice.
Richard
Hi Richard,
THanks for your posts.
You have made a number of points and asked a few questions that need a response.
The Caths I have a Coloplast Speedicath 28692 Nelaton CH/FR 12/4.0-18/6.0 mm so it says on the box. I dont know what size it is from that, can you tell?
They come in green plastic tubes with screw caps on, They dont have coude tips and are straight. I did the self in the room under instructions from the nurse. It was a somewhat "toe curling" episode which i did not enjoy. you have to pass the thing a long way down to get to the bladder.
And for the next 24 hours I had a slower stream and some blood and clots in the urine. So I am not at all keen to do it again unless its an emergency.
PLus I have had one UTI and do not want that again! I could well be back to square one with a Foley, so that is not a risk i want to take right now!
I have asked to have my PVR checked but we are talking NHS here and they just looked puzzled when I asked at the GP's, so I dont think its gonna happen. I looked on Ebay to see if I could buy myown ultrasound and they do exist but there are many options some cheaper some more expensive, including USB ones you plug into a lapop! I wouldnt like to take the risk of wasting my money though.
As regards PAE I am going to go and have the scans and assesements to see what state my prostate is in now, I need a second opinion and the NHS are very limited on this. The thing is I may be OK now but presumably my prostate is gonna keep growing so at some point I am probably gonna be in trouble again, may not in a year or two but possibly in 5- 10 years! WHo knows. I will see how it goes but I do have BPH and unless I can reduce my prostate naturally then PAE would be the way forward in my opinion.
YEs it will probably become mainstream eventually but it may only be available privatley and I would have misssed the opportunity to have it done for free as part of a trial. So I will let you know how things go.
regards
Jeremy
That's an interesting choice for Cath. You have their "compact" model. The advantage is that you can carry it around in your pocket. The disadvantage is that even though it starts out at size 12F (12 French) it is misleading. Since it's telescopic design, the widest part is probably close to 17F (higher the number wider the catheter). Compare that to what I'm using which is a true 12F all the way down the catheter. I also use a "coude tip" which is recommended for enlarged prostates. The product nuber is 28492 Tiemann Male FR 12/4.0 mm Comes in a green plastic sleeve pre-lubricated. Something to consider for the future.
The fact that you have BPH has nothing to do with whether or not you need an operation. What matters among other things is your IPSS score, and that's why I asked what it was. Plus in 5-10 years they may have something that will make PAE look antiquated.
The blood and discomfort from CIC is perfectly normal when you start. I had it for several weeks and then it went away, but I definitely understand your concern about UTI's since you don't need to cath every day and that is why I suggested you ask your doc for a bladder scan every month or so.
I also was very interested in home bladder scan units and I believe the one you mention (Veriscan lt?)with usb (probe only works with laptop) is around $6,000 USD, including an end user discount. It looks like an excellent unit but a lot of money so haven't pulled the plug yet. There is also a Chinese unit out for around 2,000USD, but not anywhere near as user friendly and looks like a real project to learn while the Vitascan unit is literally plug and play.
Every time I have had a flow test each of the four NHS hospitals I've attended over the years did a PVR (post void residual) after it. After I had my PVP in Newcastle my GP in Edinburgh referred me at their request to a local Community Clinic who did a PVR.