I was diagnosed with chronic bacterial prostatitis apparently caused by a heavy growth of the bacteria “enterococcus faecilis” - I was prescribed with a 6 week course of Amoxicillin but it has made my symptoms worse
Any one got experience of detoxing from antibiotics?
Please
Although I had to get an additional 3 weeks Ciprofloxacin due to my lady GP giving me only one week’s supply. I had already been given Tremethoprim (full strength) for a month which seemed to make the infection less but two weeks after the end of the Tremeth course the symptoms came back with a vengeance. I had already taken a week’s supply of Cipro at half the recommended dose which was prescribed by a young lady urology registrar who advised my doctor to treat me conservatively! She was of course wrong re the outcome as was my GP who prescribed only one week full strength Cipro because it clearly states in MIMMS that prostatitis should be treated with Cipro full strength for a month. I might add that the Ciprofloxacin at the correct strength worked by getting rid of my awful prostatitis symptoms.
All of my symptoms seemed to be exactly what TB in the prostate is. I proved I was latent TB positive during my waterworks problems but got that test privately. (quantiferon gold)
I do not know to this day what infection I had but a TB specialist said it may have been TB. She or any other ‘professional’ medic will not admit to anything categorical that may cause any suing by the patient. Every mortal thing discussed is in writing and I can prove anything I have said or discussed with my doctors. It is clear (to me ) that due to my records being to hand that go back to 1978 mistakes have been made re my diagnostics. It is stated by the NHS one in six
patients are misdiagnosed and it is also said that the figures may be ‘the tip of the iceberg’.
Not very comforting is it when it involves YOU ?
There is a test that can be done on ‘material’ that is obtained by biopsy which is the PCR test.
This test is apparently used for detecting difficult to isolate bacterias. I was never given that test and a doctor clammed up when I asked why did they not use that test when my waterworks were at their worst… Worst still was the fact that they had lymph nodes of mine that the PCR test may well have enlightened all and sundry what my infection was but it was not done.
I see that in Bulgaria I think a man got ‘them’ to test his wife for urinary TB which confirmed she had urinary TB by the PCR test. It has been a hell of a task for me to come to the conclusion that patients must ask doctors in writing if they will carry out certain tests if patients feel they know more than the doctors they are consulting. There are obviously some doctors who do not need to be approached by that idea but there are also some who most certainly do need to be questioned as above. This may seem ridiculous but it is not. I say that from experience.
Thanks for your response - sorry what do the letters TB stand for?
Mico baterium tuberculosis… An increasing number of doctors are aware of that bacteria that can re emerge after being quiescent for years or even decades.
I am not suggesting you have ‘it’. Your doctor or doctors should be able to confirm that the antibiotic you have been taking is the correct one for your particular infection.
It is patently obvoius that if an incorrect antibiotic is given,
i.e. the infective organism is not susceptible and not being killed by or is not stopped from multiplying by the antibiotic taken it should be accepted that if the antibiotic is ineffective then that antibiotic may well be the wrong one for resolving the infection. It seems essential to confirm the efficacy of certain antibiotics applicable to certain bacterial infections.
As I said write all instances to your carers.
You may be suitable for one of the fluoroquinalones namely Moxyfloxacin but you must be suitable for it to be less likely of severe side effects. Please read American society for microbiology about the treatment data on E faecalis bacteria in the prostate. There are warnings to any unsuitable patients and their treatment =prescription of moxyfloxacin for them
with that infection of the prostate.
Incidentally it is said in the data re the ASM that the fluoroquinalones are the penetrating antibiotics for the prostate when the others are not.
I had a semen test done - through the main lab of a private hospital group. The result was that they said I had heavy growth of enterococcus faecilis - “susceptible to Amoxicillin” - I took this for a week - and my symptoms became much much worse - in terms of constipation burning urination, defecation, inflammation generally. I had to give up. Later Consultant told me that the finding might have been the result of contamination anyway - which would be absolutely brilliant of course.
I know that Amox is no good for penetrating the prostate - I wouldn’t take a fluoroquinalone antibiotic - there have been so many adverse reports about them. I have had bad reactions to Amox, Doxycycline, Erythromycin - I now feel they are all totally toxic to my system
My GP said the amount of adverse effects to many patients is small. The research data says that moxyfloxacin is the best one to combat your problem. You must speak to a professional who can evaluate if you are likely to benefit from that antibiotic or of course if it might adversely affect you.
My situation was kill or cure and to this day I do not know what my infection was which is shamefull as per the medical profession. I do know however I may be dead if Ciprofloxacin
was not taken by me and also that I myself extended the weeks supply given by my not so intelligent but powerful GP. She was the same one who says hardly a problem for those who take Cipro? Is she right ? You must do what is right for you but as I said every mortal thing in writing for your own protection.
Thanks, I’m glad you’re well - but the Cipro et al class of antibiotics has been given a “black box” warning by the US FDA, it’s use has been restricted by the EU. Tragic and heartrending stories are online - a few months back my acupuncturist told me that a good friend of hers had committed suicide after being “floxed” . There’s always something you can do to make a bad situation even worse; after my bad experiences I just couldn’t contemplate taking an antibiotic of this class especially
I wonder exactly what I said to put my response to you into moderation
You might have been telling the truth?
Following our discussion about Cipro there will be (mark my words) some who will be telling this forum about horrendous side effects. I would ask a straight question to these people. Would you rather die than take what might give you your life back?
I would ask the doctor who said the sample might have been contaminated to expand on that and do what is necessary to rectify that situation. In writing of course. If you still have no resolution and are not cured as per your symptoms I would not let that rest.
Incidentally I was told by a urologist that ‘we don’t usually carry out a semen test’ for prostatitis but he did not add to that phrase what he did do… All I have proof of is that he was well out of his depth in being able to resolve what bacteria was affecting all of my waterworks. Due to the inadequate treatment (NIL) the infection progressed into my prostate.
You really need to consult someone professional enough to help you.
There seem to be areas on here which are deemed beyond criticism
The latest guidance on CIP et al is that its use should be proportionate to the risk it poses eg European Medicines Agency 15/11/2018 - shouldn’t be prescribed for non bacterial prostatitis
Seems entirely reasonable
I already have a letter from the prescribing doctor saying that the enterococcus faecilis could “easily have been the result of contamination” and that there were no white blood cells evident in the sample ie no infection - don’t know where that goes; my priority is getting well again
“Incidentally I was told by a urologist that ‘we don’t usually carry out a semen test’ for prostatitis but he did not add to that phrase what he did do..”
Generally nothing as far as I can see surveying the online forums and from my own limited experience - that’s a disgrace; I only got my semen test cos I absolutely insisted on it - and when I did it was misinterpreted
Today I saw another Consultant who has recommended my prostate is removed - so that’s food for thought
All doctors have power over all of us and it is not until they are proven to be ‘faulty’ they are reprimanded(probably so no one hears what transpires…
The urologist That I saw as well as his registrars told me after two years of them not knowing or rather not proving what was affecting me said we must rule out bladder cancer… I agreed to a cistoscopy but not until I felt my bladder was up to the probing. The ‘new’ chap who was great straight away sid your bladder is fine and the mucosa is good.
When I sat down to discuss with him I had already had the Quantiferon test and I asked him - how does TB affect the body. He replied it can go anywhere in the body! I then researched into that item because as a kid I was found to have had TB but was said to be immune to it. It has been a long road but I have proven to myself that TB can reemerge and is insideous
but not many doctors know about that…
If you had an MRI scan which is being carried out by certain NHS hospitals
You might well gain more info before removal. That is if you haven’t already done that. Our teaching hospital here are still biopsying without a scan but I see the Birmingham Hospital which has one of the finest prostate units in the land advocates MRI before any biopsy. I asked for an MRI and was given one at Derby but all the heads were firmly together (probably in the pub or on the golf course! ) My PSA level was 13.3 during the infection but went down to 7.2 post 33 days on the Cipro. I can still run so my ankles and tendons are still in tact. So although there are scare stories it did not affect me apart from the diahorrea which 3 days of Metronidazole put right( I had some ‘by me’) Strange these later doctors did not know what the doctors in 2011 knew when I had sepsis because I had into V Cipro and then Cipro tabs with Metrnidazole to prevent the runs after coming out of hospital.
My experience is that there are some brilliant doctors who know what they should know but there are some who seem lucky enough to pass their degree… I sometimes wonder how on earth they did it.
My urologist caused a smoke screen so that my problems were never resolved and my resistance seems to be holding up but somethings going to go wrong at 78! I hope you have an MRI scan before you have to have your prostate removed… Where they do that can be found within the NHS and you have a choice -by law.
I’m definitely going to have an MRI - I’m in an awful mess
Thats the best way forward I would have thought. I don’t know how far you are from Birmingham but after a lot of research 2016/17 I saw that Birmingham led the country for prostate problems. They were the first to instigate MRI before biopsy was done because they said far too many a biopsy was carried out unnecessarily! The Urologist who I saw was a specialist in stones… I’m confident due to experience he was out of his depth with me. He authorized lots of tests but not an MRI but he said Derby will do one for you if you don’t want a biopsy! I said to him what was the point in having a biopsy when my PSA level went down to 7.3? he did not recognize my PSA went down… The italian uro who was in charge of my
MRI said it looks as if you have stage 2 PC! I reminded him what about my PSA level going down… Oh he said that is good… I saw on the net that PC PSA levels never go down but I see an antagonistic bloke on a forum said they can go down even if!!! I don’t trust that because they do go down after an infection is eradicated… If you could afford it I would most definitely go to Birmingham There is a fantastic surgeon there (see him on the web) who seems to know all there is to know about the prostate. You can even telephone him for a price! I don’t think you could get better than them… best wishes Mick
IAN I had a thought regarding when I was researching my prostate problems I saw that the Chinese inject antibiotics directly onto the prostate after biopsy… It made sense to me at the time but I do not know if the Birmingham Prostate specialist clinic are doing that. If they are not it would surprise me because as I said I think the are at the forefront of Prostate procedures.
It would amaze me if anyone had to have a prostectomy due to an infection these days…
Incidentally the NHS are ‘flushing’ gall bladders out now but I and of course some doctors knew about that several years before the NHS have now recognised it is possible to get rid of some gall stones without gall bladder removal.
Touch wood my gall stones were dissolved when I took Urso getting on for three years now… How come several doctors said " it might not work"! An eminent surgeon said the opposite = Ursodeoxycholic acid will dissolve gall stones"!
I hope you can get the right treatment for your problems as I did but without removal!
Thanks Mickle
There is actually no one in this country doing direct injections into the prostate. Is done to a very limited extent in the US, Italy, Greece, Turkey - but it doesn’t seem very convincing from what I’ve seen. I am going off the idea of the prostatectomy
Re the Ciprofloxacin I took for thirty three days !!! Our teaching hospital’s special urology nurse told me that Cipro is their first line treatment for Prostatitis & yet none of ‘her’ doctors mentioned it until I was given a far too weak a dose for a month by a young lady Registrar.
My GP doubled that dose but only gave me a weeks supply (as they usually do). I had very bad symptoms after a week on that weak dose but when I had taken a fortnight’s worth of full strength Cipro my symptoms declined but I was adamant to eradicate as far as possible the infection I most certainly had. I had been neglected for years re my waterworks and no one listened. My prostate seemed as right as rain until very late in my on and off symptoms. It was 2010 when I produced lots of urinary stones which was never resolved but a urologist who did my MRI said the stones then could have been caused by an infection. The intricacies of the waterworks system and reproductive system is complex as you will know. It is very disconcerting when ‘you’ know you have an infection but doctors on the whole do not believe it unless there is absolute proof of the organism.
I feel strongly that not enough is done to isolate whatever bacteria is the cause of any infection because the science is there to use.
We however cannot make them do what they should do. The urologist who’s speciality is stones when he knew he had made mistakes retorted =you can’t prove you’ve had an infection! I have of course got it in black and white that I have had ‘an infection’ since childhood. I really deserve an apology from him and lots of others who quite frankly were definitekly not ‘up to it’!
You will probably be aware that some writers on this forum have dire warnings about Cipro and maybe other fuoroquinalones but what I ask is one to do suffer & then possibly let the infection do irreparable damage?
So CIPRO was quite effective in your case? It’s a tricky one - personally the risks of being “floxed” terrify me
I agree the fact that that semen/prostatic fluid tests are not a matter of routine is a disgrace
How can they say that the vast majority of cases are chronic non bacterial when they aren’t doing the testing?
It’s absurd
I am awaiting the result of a semen sample DNA sequencing test - whatever that might amount to; sent sample to Texas
UK medicine seems to be well behind the curve