Silent, creeping narrowing of vaginal introitus

Women's health
1

I'm wondering whether it would be proactive to regularly dilate this opening (even with warm oily fingers). I've been abstaining from sex for a year – too painful. Silly me, I've been using a magnifying shaving mirror to inspect my undercarriage nightly and last night it occurred to me to look with a regular mirror. Whoa! I'm a lot narrower than I thought! About two fingers. What I've been noticing in my inspections has been the narrowing and elongation of my perineum. I took that to be a tightening of the flesh from repeated tearing. But now I see it's that the 'shore' of the perineum is sneaking up on the vagina. Like a beach getting wider as the lake's water level drops.

My goal (a modest one) is to always be able to pee. So I think I might make a practice of massaging – slightly stretching that circle every night when applying my oily stuff. Not at the same time as applying Dermovate/clobetasol.

2

Good recommendation!!  I shall do so also.  Thanks Morrell.  

3

Yes good idea. I do it sometimes as well when applying my stuff. I too am noticing that bridge of skin creeping over the opening a little more and its tearing more often. My gyn says sex is a good thing for vulva and vaginal health and I always felt having intercourse would help keep it stretched. But not sure its enough cause I still get tiny tears then have to wait a week or so for healing.  May eventually need to use dialators.

Im still hoping the estrogen cream will start making the skin more elastic.

Will definitely start self massaging more often. 

4

Yes good idea. I do it sometimes as well when applying my stuff. I too am noticing that bridge of skin creeping over the opening a little more and its tearing more often. My gyn says sex is a good thing for vulva and vaginal health and I always felt having intercourse would help keep it stretched. But not sure its enough cause I still get tiny tears then have to wait a week or so for healing.  May eventually need to use dialators.

Im still hoping the estrogen cream will start making the skin more elastic.

Will definitely start self massaging more often. 

5

It's a good thought and might well work.

6

Yes a good idea, morall, I bought dilators a while ago but not got them out yet but I think I should, my gyny said to rub a little clob along this bridge. My fear is closing up.

7

"morrell" 

8

I don't think it's that sex is not enough – I think sex is too much. Manual self massage has a built-in brake. No way will we tear ourselves.

9

I've just Googled vaginal dilators. They're very phallic – they seem to be meant to dilate the entire interior. I'm inclined to think fingers will be superior for stretching the tightening outer bridges and hardened surface. It's mostly that fourchette bridge at the back, so I'm thinking just working that back & forth a bit. Tonight's my soak/clob night, so I'll start in the bath ...

10

Be careful to not hurt yourself, Morrell.

11

Yeah, that's why I'm not enlisting my husband. I'll know when to stop. The slightest friction tends to stir up the yeast. Maybe 'massage' is the wrong term. That's friction. Maybe just gentle stretching. Little, but often. The theory that sex will take care of it doesn't make any sense to me. Maybe for general post-menopausal atrophy, but this hard skin bridge is entirely different.

12

I was just talking to my sister, who's a nurse. She's used dilators on patients – 15 minutes three times a day. These are patients with raw surfaces that want to heal shut. So to be proactive you wouldn't think you'd need more than once a day. Maybe I should order a set. Slip one in and sit at the computer, I could work that into my schedule.

13

That is if these things are flexing.  Otherwise you'll need what I call 'the lay sit'.  I use one of these tables on wheels of which part rides under my chair.  Can then still work on my laptop.  Perhaps a thought.  

14

Oh, I see. Too stiff to sit up with.

I found a pamphlet on dilator use online from Ottawa Hospital.

Use the dilator or have vaginal penetration a minimum of three times a week.

Dilators can be used in the shower or bath

Once the dilator is inside your vagina, use a forward and backward motion to move the dilator, then a left to right motion. If possible, gently rotate the dilator.

Use the dilator for five to ten minutes each time. Practice doing pelvic floor exercises (Kegel) while the dilator is in your vagina.

Remove the dilator by slowly rotating it in clockwise / anticlockwise movements as you withdraw it.

You may use vibrators instead of dilators if you prefer.

Wash the dilator with hot water and gentle fatted soap such as Dove. Rinse well. Dry well and store in a clean, dry place.

The dilator does not need to be sterile.

Massage muscle pump cycle

If you are struggling to make progress with the dilators, massaging the inner walls of the vagina and stretching the entrance first may help.

Sit comfortably on your bed, pillows behind you for support, with your knees comfortably bent.

Massage the walls of the vaginal between 3, 6 and 9 O’clock with your lubricated thumb or finger.

Alternate, a one minute massage with five to ten Kegel exercises, feeling the muscles contract and relax equally under your finger or thumb. The pumping action created by the movement of the muscles should help to improve the blood supply and health of the vaginal tissues. Hook your thumb or finger around the entrance of the vagina and stretching firmly.

Move your thumb to another part of the vulva clock face and repeat the massage-muscle pump cycle.

This is very much like what I was going to try.

15

Hi Morrell--I was given some dialators to use when I saw a practitioner this past spring.  At the time we thought that it might be menopause causing the narrowing and pain during sex, but later found it was LS.  I tried them for a while, but have held off for months now fearing that the stress might add to the Koebner effect.  When I tried them nightly for a couple of weeks, it felt like I was back to square one EACH night--that tissue just didn't want to stay stretchy like normal vaginal tissue.  At the time, I finally concluded that until I was in remission with normal stretchy skin, it didn't make sense to keep pulling on taut, tight, damaged skin.  I don't know how I feel about it at this point--ambivalent, I guess.  The dialators that I was given are rigid, bullet-shaped devices.  A flexible dildo might be more user friendly.  Please report back on your thoughts and progress.  --Suzanne

16

One other thought, Morrell--You mentioned getting yeast infections after sex.  That makes me curious because I remember reading about possible viral/bacterial/fungal triggers with LS.  I have definitely wondered about possibly harboring a subclinical yeast issue.  I know that we all carry it, but under certain conditions it is allowed to overgrow--like too much sugar, estrogens, or antibiotics.  Sometimes I notice slightly clumpy looking vaginal secretions and a bit of a yeasty odor, though I don't have overt symptoms.  It is certainly possible that our bodies are waging an attack on the yeast and are being overaggressive to our own tissues.  If sex brings on an infection readily for you, have you considered that you may have a possible subclinical issue going on that could be contributing to the LS? All the more reason to lower our sugar intake and stay away from antibiotics.  --Suzanne  

17

I recall reading or hearing years ago that yeast is like dandelions – it has deep roots and when you stir up the dirt it only encourages them to grow. Friction, sex, and sugar are a killer combo, my pharmacist said.

Could be that the type of skin we have is extra vulnerable to yeast. Those little clumps you mention – that's exactly what I noted in the mirror last time. It was the day after I'd had a difficult visit with my mother and rebelled on the drive home by eating a (kiddie-size) ice cream cone. I tried some yogurt down there for a day or so, but then bought the 6-day Canestan cream. (not the one day suppository – I call it The Bomb – too harsh.) I think we should waste no time treating those little clumps. A major goopy yeast infection causes such raw skin – just doubles the LS problem, I'm sure.

In the old days I'd put up with the burning until I had full-blown cottage cheese. And I'd have sex, adding extra friction to the mix.

18

I looked up dilators last night. The biggest one in the set is smaller than me. They're for post-op and cancer patients who are all raw and there's fear of healing closed, like Hanny. And they're for the whole length of the vagina, while we just have the outside edge growing tighter.

Last night was clob night, so I put half a cup of baking soda (like we said) in the water and soaked for five minutes before trying two, then three fingers. No rubbing or scraping. Only Kegels and a little gentle stretching of the bridge this way and that, but mostly Kegels for ten minutes. Then just soaking for the last five minutes. No bad effects afterwards.

This I think is a good preventitive routine for after sex is already impossible or too painful / irritating. I'll do it twice a week on clob nights. It's not unpleasant or technical, just a good substitute for the stretching of regular sex. The dilator pamphlet said three times a week, but I think this is good for longterm prevention.

19

hi Morrell

I read your post last night and froze....I had to get out of the site.

This morning I went to a sex shop and bought  a thing ....it looks like a

real penis. I came home and tried to use it but I don't have a big

20

hi Morrell

I read your post last night and froze....I had to get out of the site.

This morning I went to a sex shop and bought  a thing ....it looks like a

real penis. I came home and tried to use it but I don't have a big enough

opening. perhaps an inch.  I am really scared because I am going away in a

months time and will be gone for four months. This desease is travelling too fast for me in my body.. Although I don't live in Ottawa anymore, I am from there and go back a few times a year.  Is there a specialist there that deals with LS